Hoopster Rankings

[bk1990]

I don't think Packer21 is saying that Kindred is "guilty" he's just pointing out how they have benefited from having a kid move into the district.

Exactly move and do whatever you want, I think Kindred has benefitted just as much as OG lately. I only mentioned it because MADDOG keepts trolling the privates. How many state titles did "only" have those two families help bring back to Kindred?

Yep... I troll "Minot" I grew up in the area so the Minot private angers me that they are not in class A. I have always said and will stand by that private have an advantage over Hankinson. I believe they have it right as far as he classes. By the way what did Ryan have for Seniors last year? Quite a few. I heard they will not be good this year.... well they are ranked already.... So....
Also nobody is feeling sorry for Kindred but I know of two families that have moved to Kindred in the last 19 years that have played Varsity sports. I know of more kids that have went to Shanley/Davies/ West Fargo that live in the Kindred School district.

That explains it, grew up by Minot, probably had to play Bishop Ryan. You talk about the advantages the privates have over, as you mention, Hankinson. As if have in the past, I agree their is an advantage to living in a larger city, the availability of resources, such as gyms, workout programs, other people to compete against, etc. But it still comes down the the kids putting in time. I will also go back to off season programs, whether it is summer Y basketball league, which small towns do put together teams to play, team camps and other such activities.
I will also bring up AAU basketball. Although it does not help teach fundamental basketball, it does give the opportunity to compete against quality players in the offseason, this is where you get better. The argument that not everyone can do AAU is a not totally accurate. In ND, we are fortunate that the AAU programs haven't evolved into For Profit programs. The people I have heard that run these programs are mainly doing it to make better players and try to not let cost be a factor.
Another argument I feel that is not valid is, families don't have the time in the summer to be going a couple weekends a month to tournaments. This comes done to choice. Some people chose to buy a boat or cabin and spend weekends at the lake, others chose to have 6-8 mini vacations a summer and go watch their child play basketball, geography isn't a valid reason in my opinion also. Last time I looked, Hankinson is a lot closer to Minneapolis and Sioux Falls than Minot or even Bismarck where a large number of tournaments are held.
Looking at the ranked teams for A and B, most of these teams have kids that play AAU, the put extra time in and it shows, your typical AAU team will play 30 games in a summer, that is more than the high school season, that is a lot of minutes against quality competition.
This got a little long winded, but just my thoughts, agree or disagree, fire away, I know there will be someone who thinks I am way off base and the system is still unfair

[maddog1971]

I am for every private school in this state now ... all but Ryan. Last year people were saying they will have nothing for next year... well this year is here... lets see if they win 5 games this year but I am betting we will see them at the state Tournament this year again.. and again and again....

I never went after Oak Grove... someone said they were not very good team so one kid shot all the time and I thought they had really good players and a good team. I just did not think it was a winning formula for one kid to shoot that much.
and yes Kindred gets kids from a number of small towns and developments. By the way.. a number of schools do the same thing. Not new in the state of North Dakota

[Dakotastater]

Just want to clarify that Hickson, Oxbow, Davenport, Leonard, Walcott, and portions of Horace are in the Kindred School District, so kids living in those communities attending Kindred is not much of a surprise. Kindred School also has a very limited open enrollment. Basically, unless your family has students already enrolled in Kindred, or are the child of an established employee of the district open enrollment requests will be denied. More students actually open enroll out of Kindred than in.

I am for every private school in this state now ... all but Ryan. Last year people were saying they will have nothing for next year... well this year is here... lets see if they win 5 games this year but I am betting we will see them at the state Tournament this year again.. and again and again....

I never went after Oak Grove... someone said they were not very good team so one kid shot all the time and I thought they had really good players and a good team. I just did not think it was a winning formula for one kid to shoot that much.
and yes Kindred gets kids from a number of small towns and developments. By the way.. a number of schools do the same thing. Not new in the state of North Dakota

[BasketballMind]

It is interesting that the thing many small town fanbases accuse Oak Grove, Trinity, Shiloh, and Bishop Ryan for (recruiting) does not get the same fervor as the Class B towns that "open enroll" kids who also happen to be excellent at sports.

[leroybla]

Possibly using the word "recruiting" is incorrect. Athletes can (and have) elect to attend various schools for various reasons. I remember an official at a Fargo private school telling me that they didn't know what kind of team they would have until they knew who Fargo South was cutting.

[WalkingStick]

Possibly using the word "recruiting" is incorrect. Athletes can (and have) elect to attend various schools for various reasons. I remember an official at a Fargo private school telling me that they didn't know what kind of team they would have until they knew who Fargo South was cutting.

And yet in this scenario an athlete would still have to sit out 365 days of Varsity athletics…so you wouldn’t know for a full year what you’d have.

[maddog1971]

WELL.... Families move. I don't know the reasons but they do. Fact of life. BUT again in class B their should be any private schools. Private schools spend way to much time in the state tournament. If Ryan makes it again this year after have a large class of seniors leave the program... that will prove my point over and over and over again.

[bk1990]

WELL.... Families move. I don't know the reasons but they do. Fact of life. BUT again in class B their should be any private schools. Private schools spend way to much time in the state tournament. If Ryan makes it again this year after have a large class of seniors leave the program... that will prove my point over and over and over again.

I shouldn't weigh in, at this point in time I feel it probably is just beating a dead horse, but I enjoy a good debate.
If Ryan makes State, all it proves is that the new 3 class system watered down the system and in some aspects it makes it easier to make it to state (8 more teams get to go).
Since Bishop Ryan seems to be your focus, lets looks at it.
Yes, Ryan did graduate a large number of seniors last year, but now they don't have to face schools 2 or 2 1/2 times their size on a nightly basis. They have one returning starter, the stat line I saw from Saturday and from what I heard, he had 29 points, 12 rebounds, and only missed one shot all night, he went 2 for 3 from 3 point land. This was against double even triple teams frequently. I think it would be fun to see him playing up a division or two, he could probably more than hold his own in any division. I think he has been at Ryan since elementary school.
A starting guard had 23 points, 8 rebounds and was lights out from 3 land, he was being face guarded quite often, he is the starting quarterback on the football team and 2 time all state, he has been there since elementary school also. A quick search of past rosters show 2 other starters have been there also since grade school and are pretty much all the bench players, including the freshman and 8 graders needed to fill out the JV roster.
So I will ask again, how will your point be proven? Because kids who have been there since grade school have played together and are a good team? Just give the kids and the culture a little bit of credit rather than make wild accusations and take away from what they accomplish, be better than that.

[WalkingStick]

Possibly using the word "recruiting" is incorrect. Athletes can (and have) elect to attend various schools for various reasons. I remember an official at a Fargo private school telling me that they didn't know what kind of team they would have until they knew who Fargo South was cutting.

And yet in this scenario an athlete would still have to sit out 365 days of Varsity athletics…so you wouldn’t know for a full year what you’d have.

Moving wouldn't make any student eligible at Shanley or Oak Grove because they already live in Fargo...transfer students living in the Fargo school district have to sit out at any school they transfer to within Fargo.

[maddog1971]

Yep Ryan is just like every other small town in North Dakota. Struggling to keep the lights on and to fill out a roster. Yes.. Ok they go to state every year and compete to a state title every year... just like every other small town in Class B. That just means that they are in the correct class. I am wrong.

IN NO WAY does Ryan look like a small town class B School.

[Region 1 Fan]

Possibly using the word "recruiting" is incorrect. Athletes can (and have) elect to attend various schools for various reasons. I remember an official at a Fargo private school telling me that they didn't know what kind of team they would have until they knew who Fargo South was cutting.

And yet in this scenario an athlete would still have to sit out 365 days of Varsity athletics…so you wouldn’t know for a full year what you’d have.

Moving wouldn't make any student eligible at Shanley or Oak Grove because they already live in Fargo...transfer students living in the Fargo school district have to sit out at any school they transfer to within Fargo.

Another point, name 1 player that has transferred into OG after 9th grade that played more than a couple of minutes a game (Basketball) - The answer is zero or at least I can not think of one. I've been a supporter for various reason throughout the years; from being a student in the 80's, to having my kids graduate from this school and now having my oldest grandchild attend the elementary. I like the debate of competition and not the bashing or making false assumptions on how a school operates. It might be a tough year to start for this years team as they have a lot of young unproven talent that will be playing but they have one of the best coaches in ND to learn from and will grow immensely from his coaching - both as a player and young person. If this school recruited athletes, they wouldn't have had near 500 records over the past few years and wouldn't be in a position to only win a few games this year. Not to mention, they have struggled for years in Football and Girls basketball. OG may be considered a Private school but they have not benefited from kids coming into the school and impacting their sports programs to a level that some on this site suggest. If that was the case, they would be perennial powerhouses in every sport and not just a good boys basketball program.

[RiverMiner99]

Possibly using the word "recruiting" is incorrect. Athletes can (and have) elect to attend various schools for various reasons. I remember an official at a Fargo private school telling me that they didn't know what kind of team they would have until they knew who Fargo South was cutting.

And yet in this scenario an athlete would still have to sit out 365 days of Varsity athletics…so you wouldn’t know for a full year what you’d have.

Moving wouldn't make any student eligible at Shanley or Oak Grove because they already live in Fargo...transfer students living in the Fargo school district have to sit out at any school they transfer to within Fargo.

Another point, name 1 player that has transferred into OG after 9th grade that played more than a couple of minutes a game (Basketball) - The answer is zero or at least I can not think of one. I've been a supporter for various reason throughout the years; from being a student in the 80's, to having my kids graduate from this school and now having my oldest grandchild attend the elementary. I like the debate of competition and not the bashing or making false assumptions on how a school operates. It might be a tough year to start for this years team as they have a lot of young unproven talent that will be playing but they have one of the best coaches in ND to learn from and will grow immensely from his coaching - both as a player and young person. If this school recruited athletes, they wouldn't have had near 500 records over the past few years and wouldn't be in a position to only win a few games this year. Not to mention, they have struggled for years in Football and Girls basketball. OG may be considered a Private school but they have not benefited from kids coming into the school and impacting their sports programs to a level that some on this site suggest. If that was the case, they would be perennial powerhouses in every sport and not just a good boys basketball program.

CJK would be one.

Oak Grove has had success because they have a good program ran by a good coach. The kids buy into the program and put in the time working on their game. They always play a great schedule that gets them prepare for the region tournament. They may be down a little at this time, but I'm sure that will cycle back in the future. Every school has their ups and downs and Oak Grove is not different.

Do they recruit or not, that depends on what you consider recruiting.

[WalkingStick]

name 1 player that has transferred into OG after 9th grade that played more than a couple of minutes a game (Basketball)

I can name 4...but 3 of those had to sit out and play JV for the full year before being eligible

*2 were decent players back in the early 2010s from Fargo South (probably the talking point of the original post)

*1 rarely played varsity outside of blowouts in 2014 (which they were good that year so there were several blowouts) - came from Shanley; was a good practice player though, as I've been told

*most recent (2022) came from WF but did move from WF to Fargo to be eligible...was a role player and not a difference maker.

Carter Kretchman came in as a Freshman, eligible right away; this really only happened because Tanner was 'recruited' away from Kindred to go to Fargo Davies...where he had to sit out and play JV for a season.

[Region 1 Fan]

name 1 player that has transferred into OG after 9th grade that played more than a couple of minutes a game (Basketball)

I can name 4...but 3 of those had to sit out and play JV for the full year before being eligible

*2 were decent players back in the early 2010s from Fargo South (probably the talking point of the original post)

*1 rarely played varsity outside of blowouts in 2014 (which they were good that year so there were several blowouts) - came from Shanley; was a good practice player though, as I've been told

*most recent (2022) came from WF but did move from WF to Fargo to be eligible...was a role player and not a difference maker.

Carter Kretchman came in as a Freshman, eligible right away; this really only happened because Tanner was 'recruited' away from Kindred to go to Fargo Davies...where he had to sit out and play JV for a season.

Well, there you go. Shows you what I know, which is not much

[maddog1971]

I don't claim to know either but how about the Rodriguez brothers? That was recent. And that kid that played a couple years ago that came from West Fargo. Not big minute guy but he played.
It honestly means nothing to me any more since OG is playing in a class A system where they belong. And remember all private schools... yes many will make it to state again this year but just because you are not winning every game does not mean it is a bad season.

[WalkingStick]

I don't claim to know either but how about the Rodriguez brothers? That was recent. And that kid that played a couple years ago that came from West Fargo. Not big minute guy but he played.
It honestly means nothing to me any more since OG is playing in a class A system where they belong. And remember all private schools... yes many will make it to state again this year but just because you are not winning every game does not mean it is a bad season.

West Fargo player was the one I listed in 2022...role player...just an extra body.

Rodriguez brothers came in at (older) and before (younger) Freshman years...Neither Rodriguez brother played meaningful minutes until Junior seasons.

A majority of the athletes at OG, I believe, were at the school through JH...a small number added in at Freshman year (natural break) and an extremely small number transfer in after 9th grade.

[bk1990]

Yep Ryan is just like every other small town in North Dakota. Struggling to keep the lights on and to fill out a roster. Yes.. Ok they go to state every year and compete to a state title every year... just like every other small town in Class B. That just means that they are in the correct class. I am wrong.

IN NO WAY does Ryan look like a small town class B School.

Why makes them not look like a small town school? Please clarify. They are struggling to fill out a roster, on NDHSAA site, they have 3 eight graders on their roster, with a total of 16 players for grades 8-12. I'm assuming the 8thgraders are playing C/JV games. Looking at their schedule, they aren't playing A,B and C squad games, so just like other small schools in B, which they were placed due to their size, it appears they are just like other small town Class B schools

[WalkingStick]

Yep Ryan is just like every other small town in North Dakota. Struggling to keep the lights on and to fill out a roster. Yes.. Ok they go to state every year and compete to a state title every year... just like every other small town in Class B. That just means that they are in the correct class. I am wrong.

IN NO WAY does Ryan look like a small town class B School.

Why makes them not look like a small town school? Please clarify. They are struggling to fill out a roster, on NDHSAA site, they have 3 eight graders on their roster, with a total of 16 players for grades 8-12. I'm assuming the 8thgraders are playing C/JV games. Looking at their schedule, they aren't playing A,B and C squad games, so just like other small schools in B, which they were placed due to their size, it appears they are just like other small town Class B schools

And their girls are 0-4; had 2 games last week vs. Class B opponents where they didn't crack 20 points...but we never look at the girls side of things when complaining about the 3 classes...this has always been fueled by BBB. Roster looks very similar on the girls side

[maddog1971]

Yep Ryan is just like every other small town in North Dakota. Struggling to keep the lights on and to fill out a roster. Yes.. Ok they go to state every year and compete to a state title every year... just like every other small town in Class B. That just means that they are in the correct class. I am wrong.

IN NO WAY does Ryan look like a small town class B School.

Why makes them not look like a small town school? Please clarify. They are struggling to fill out a roster, on NDHSAA site, they have 3 eight graders on their roster, with a total of 16 players for grades 8-12. I'm assuming the 8thgraders are playing C/JV games. Looking at their schedule, they aren't playing A,B and C squad games, so just like other small schools in B, which they were placed due to their size, it appears they are just like other small town Class B schools

Ryan
1937, 1938, 1939, 1942, 1943, 1994, 1999, 2000, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2011, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2022. and how many times have they been in the regional championship game to go to state....

yep... Every small town like Warwick... who has been there 3 times in school history.

This is the reason we needed the new class so Privates can not dominate class B basketball....
Shiloh
1996, 1998, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023
DT
1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2011, 2013, 2016, 2017, 2021

[maddog1971]

Yep Ryan is just like every other small town in North Dakota. Struggling to keep the lights on and to fill out a roster. Yes.. Ok they go to state every year and compete to a state title every year... just like every other small town in Class B. That just means that they are in the correct class. I am wrong.

IN NO WAY does Ryan look like a small town class B School.

Why makes them not look like a small town school? Please clarify. They are struggling to fill out a roster, on NDHSAA site, they have 3 eight graders on their roster, with a total of 16 players for grades 8-12. I'm assuming the 8thgraders are playing C/JV games. Looking at their schedule, they aren't playing A,B and C squad games, so just like other small schools in B, which they were placed due to their size, it appears they are just like other small town Class B schools

Ryan
1937, 1938, 1939, 1942, 1943, 1994, 1999, 2000, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2011, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2022. and how many times have they been in the regional championship game to go to state....

yep... Every small town like Warwick... who has been there 3 times in school history.

This is the reason we needed the new class so Privates can not dominate class B basketball....
Shiloh
1996, 1998, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023
DT
1999, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2011, 2013, 2016, 2017, 2021

[WalkingStick]

Please post it a 3rd time so you can beat the horse some more...

Bishop Ryan, Our Redeemer's and Trinity Christian will not be going anywhere for at least two years...so you can whine all you want here...whining here gets nothing done; then NDHSAA does not care about complaints here. They cared about being sued and went with a compromise of the plan to avoid that...and open the door for movement by success.

[Thundersnow]

In my opinion, 2 schools got put in the wrong class: Devils Lake should be in AA, Minot Ryan should be in A. Other than these 2, everyone else landed where they belong. I refuse to complain about a system that has 98.5% of schools in the correct class. As I've gotten older, I've seen how petty it is to cheer against high schoolers while they play a game because they're participating in a system that they had no say in or control over. If you hold a grudge against Minot Ryan (or Devils Lake or any other high school) that is your right, but you just sound petty to anyone who looks at the big picture.

[Flying Wallenda]

In my opinion, 2 schools got put in the wrong class: Devils Lake should be in AA, Minot Ryan should be in A. Other than these 2, everyone else landed where they belong. I refuse to complain about a system that has 98.5% of schools in the correct class. As I've gotten older, I've seen how petty it is to cheer against high schoolers while they play a game because they're participating in a system that they had no say in or control over. If you hold a grudge against Minot Ryan (or Devils Lake or any other high school) that is your right, but you just sound petty to anyone who looks at the big picture.

I'm pretty sure no one on this forum is out there cheering against individual kids. The problem people have is the shady way this came about, allowing schools to pick where they wanted to go, changing enrollment cutoffs to gather votes, etc.

[Thundersnow]

In my opinion, 2 schools got put in the wrong class: Devils Lake should be in AA, Minot Ryan should be in A. Other than these 2, everyone else landed where they belong. I refuse to complain about a system that has 98.5% of schools in the correct class. As I've gotten older, I've seen how petty it is to cheer against high schoolers while they play a game because they're participating in a system that they had no say in or control over. If you hold a grudge against Minot Ryan (or Devils Lake or any other high school) that is your right, but you just sound petty to anyone who looks at the big picture.

I'm pretty sure no one on this forum is out there cheering against individual kids. The problem people have is the shady way this came about, allowing schools to pick where they wanted to go, changing enrollment cutoffs to gather votes, etc.

Fair enough. If there was shady dealings done behind closed doors that allowed school officials to pick their class, that is shameful. And I will reiterate once again: my common sense-ometer tells me that Devils Lake belongs in Class AA and Minot Ryan belongs in Class A. Despite this opinion, I recognize that this year's 3-class system is vastly superior to the 2-class system that we had through last year.

[Flying Wallenda]

In my opinion, 2 schools got put in the wrong class: Devils Lake should be in AA, Minot Ryan should be in A. Other than these 2, everyone else landed where they belong. I refuse to complain about a system that has 98.5% of schools in the correct class. As I've gotten older, I've seen how petty it is to cheer against high schoolers while they play a game because they're participating in a system that they had no say in or control over. If you hold a grudge against Minot Ryan (or Devils Lake or any other high school) that is your right, but you just sound petty to anyone who looks at the big picture.

I'm pretty sure no one on this forum is out there cheering against individual kids. The problem people have is the shady way this came about, allowing schools to pick where they wanted to go, changing enrollment cutoffs to gather votes, etc.

Fair enough. If there was shady dealings done behind closed doors that allowed school officials to pick their class, that is shameful. And I will reiterate once again: my common sense-ometer tells me that Devils Lake belongs in Class AA and Minot Ryan belongs in Class A. Despite this opinion, I recognize that this year's 3-class system is vastly superior to the 2-class system that we had through last year.

I agree, both of those schools are in the wrong class.