Talk some smack.

Class B Boys
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Postby 4 Winds Indians Hoops Fan » Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:06 pm

I'd like to hear how you guys really feel about this topic of the first round district stomping of Maddock, a school very well known for its great football program and that has been the focus of their sports program for many years, but that doesn't always translate into basketball talent, trust me when teams play 4 winds in football, a sport new to the school system, they often get hammered by the Lakota's or Maddocks so I ask you all.

If you had a #2 Ranked High School Boys Basketball program at your disposal, who's style of play is up tempo, not necessarily run and gun but excels in the fast break game, who can create easy scoring opportunities for themselves pretty much every time down the court, you are telling me that you would tell them to ease back in what everyone is calling the only time of the year that counts???? 

You risk many things when you do this, you risk defensive lapses, higher turnover rate and worst of all you risk taking away that edge, that fire, that drive that got you where you are today.  If I'm coaching them, I let the dawgs out, I tell them, lets put the women and children to bed and go looking for dinner!!!!

In actuality 4 winds has been pulling back the reigns quite a bit this year if noone knows then they should look into it, there is a time to do that, Districts, Regionals and State are not those times. 

War letting the dawgs out.

The Natural Out
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Postby ND_SportsNut » Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:19 pm

As a matter of fact I have a #1 team at my disposal a.k.a D-Town.  And ya we play an uptempo game and yes its fun to watch. But for example on thursday we played Jamestown and we were killing them so the starters sat in the 4th.  Mr. Basketball only played 20 minutes of the game. We're cruising right into the EDC tourney also, we just know how a respected basketball team plays.
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Postby ND_SportsNut » Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:21 pm

Why aren't you at the FW game going on right now?
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Postby Ming01 » Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:59 pm

The really good teams that play with class know when enough is enough.  When a score gets out of hand they know when to do the right thing. 
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Postby nativegolfer » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:46 pm

So you mean to tell me that if your up by 50 at the start of the 4th quarter you tell your second string to just pass the ball around so you won't hurt the other teams feelings?  Those second teamers are going to be your starters next year.  Let them execute the offense and defense they have been practicing all season long.  This is a mans game.  if your opponent doesn't want to excel at BB by putting in long hours out of season then it's to dang bad for them if they kicked around during the season!  I have no sympathy for them.    JL
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Postby Ming01 » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:50 pm

Did I ever say anything about the 2nd string not scoring?  It's better to have them in then the starters.
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Postby NATURAL TALENT » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:56 pm

Nativegolfer, on a serious thought, why is it so important to keep your starters in the game for almost the whole fourth quarter when your team is already up by 30+ points? Especially this late in the year, if Four Winds was to lose a starter, that could very well mean a trip to the state tournament. Its just common sense that these kids need to ride the pine when the game is under control at halftime.
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Postby NDSportsFan » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:10 pm

Well If they have been an up tempo team it's hard to slow them down, even if your a  coach.  When you tell a team like that to start playing conservative it can back fire on  you.

Let's let the kids play and have fun, it's high school  ball.
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Postby nativegolfer » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:13 pm

They didn't have their starters in for most of the fourth quarter.  I saw second stringers for most of that quarter.  JL
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Postby ndfan » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:23 pm

They are gonna score 80 or 90 points right now but wait tell the State tournament gets started. You think a Bowman, Trinity, PBK, or a Mayville are gonna let them score that. NOT gonna happen. They will be good games no doubt about it, four winds hasnt been tested yet. What are they gonna do when they get in a close game with a good team? Whole different ball game when state comes along.
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Postby NATURAL TALENT » Mon Feb 27, 2006 8:10 pm

[suB]Native, didnt Tony Ironheart have 28 points. He went out with what......3 and some odd minutes to go in the 4th?? Thought thats what i saw.[/suB]
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Postby nativegolfer » Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:09 am

NT, I thought he went out earlier than that but I may be wrong.  I'll stick by the point I wanted to make which was when the second string is in they should be given the opportunity to play just as hard as the first team and if your are a crappy team I have no sympathy for you if you get blown out.  If you don't want your behind kicked then work on your game in the off season.

 

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Postby Irisheyes » Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:39 am

A team as good as four winds has nothing to prove by scoring that many points.  If the subs come in and do run and gun, that must be what is working so let them.  However, I noticed last year that starters on Varsity were playing 2-3 quarters of JV so they could blow some teams out.  Everone was so proud last year of their B squad scoring 100 points so many times.  Well, one thing I do know is those type things come back to get ya.  If you do it 3 straight games at State Tourney, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.  I think your subs should come in and play hard and try to score, always.  That is good coaching.  But leaving a kid in to long has caught up to a lot of former coaches.  Good Luck!!  Can't wait for Regionals.
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Postby nativegolfer » Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:55 am

Look, I know all of the coaches at 4 winds personally.  To suggest that they put players into games for the purpose of scoring 100 points is not true!  What I see is them running the offense and defense they have been working on in practice.  This is the best way for the players to internalize it.  If they happen to be up by 30 or score 100 points then that is more a coincidence than anything.  JL
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Postby Indians Alumni » Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:42 am

Putting Varsity players in a JV games helps the younger players learn the offense.  It helps them run an offense.  Those Varsity players will put their JV teammates in their righ position and run an offense.  It also gets these kids as much basketball time as they can get.  They get 5 quarters a night so why not use them? 

Back to the issue, You coach your kids to be aggressive, you only take away their edge and when you tell them to pass up easy shots or running on a team.  Yeah you work on your offense, but the goal of offense is to score, you don't coach them to pass on easy scoring oppritunities.  You coach them to take advantage of that!  I could see the point of letting up in grade school, but still have a slight problem with that.

ND_Sportsnut, I believe there is a forum for Class A, Let me direct you go to the top of this page, click on High School Athletics, then click on Class - A Boys Basketball, or you can go back to the forum designated for FW vs DL.  Not being a jerk, just wasted time reading your "words of wit".
Last edited by Indians Alumni on Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Irisheyes » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:06 am

Well put.  I agree.  I was just saying that 2 or 3 STARTERS from last years team were playing 2-3 quarters a night of JV.  Yeah, they have that right I guess but when you are beating teams by 70-80 points, what are they actually improving on?  Score and score until you get stopped, but there is a huge difference from learning or working on something and being ahead by 35 points.  Develop younger kids and let the big dogs play varsity.  I think you get six quarters a night now too.  I agree, them them play quarters but sounded like a lot of games were over 100 points scored, like ten. 
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Postby ND_SportsNut » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:41 am

Indians Alumni wrote:Putting Varsity players in a JV games helps the younger players learn the offense.  It helps them run an offense.  Those Varsity players will put their JV teammates in their righ position and run an offense.  It also gets these kids as much basketball time as they can get.  They get 5 quarters a night so why not use them? 

Back to the issue, You coach your kids to be aggressive, you only take away their edge and when you tell them to pass up easy shots or running on a team.  Yeah you work on your offense, but the goal of offense is to score, you don't coach them to pass on easy scoring oppritunities.  You coach them to take advantage of that!  I could see the point of letting up in grade school, but still have a slight problem with that.

ND_Sportsnut, I believe there is a forum for Class A, Let me direct you go to the top of this page, click on High School Athletics, then click on Class - A Boys Basketball, or you can go back to the forum designated for FW vs DL.  Not being a jerk, just wasted time reading your "words of wit".

The FW vs DL was locked and FWIndiansHoopsFan opened this one up to continue argueing on something that some of us had just been discussing earlier. Plus it was your choice to read my post. So don't talk to me like I'm some retard especially if your the one that is stupid.
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Postby Indians Alumni » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:47 am

4 Winds Indians Hoops Fan wrote:I'd like to hear how you guys really feel about this topic of the first round district stomping of Maddock, a school very well known for its great football program and that has been the focus of their sports program for many years, but that doesn't always translate into basketball talent, trust me when teams play 4 winds in football, a sport new to the school system, they often get hammered by the Lakota's or Maddocks so I ask you all.

If you had a #2 Ranked High School Boys Basketball program at your disposal, who's style of play is up tempo, not necessarily run and gun but excels in the fast break game, who can create easy scoring opportunities for themselves pretty much every time down the court, you are telling me that you would tell them to ease back in what everyone is calling the only time of the year that counts???? 

You risk many things when you do this, you risk defensive lapses, higher turnover rate and worst of all you risk taking away that edge, that fire, that drive that got you where you are today.  If I'm coaching them, I let the dawgs out, I tell them, lets put the women and children to bed and go looking for dinner!!!!

In actuality 4 winds has been pulling back the reigns quite a bit this year if noone knows then they should look into it, there is a time to do that, Districts, Regionals and State are not those times. 

War letting the dawgs out.

The Natural Out



No where in that opening statement is there a referrence to class A!!! Any one with an eighth grade education can read!  I can also say that in the title and sub-title there is no referrence to class A!!!

He says anyone else who wants to bring it, in regards to the game vs Maddock, you are referrencing Class A topics of last week, I think the horse is dead, you can stop beating it if you want, it is like bringing your knife to a gun fight!!

I can look past it, but I didn't realize until after I had wasted my 2 minutes, I would like to those two minutes back please!
Last edited by Indians Alumni on Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby NDSportsFan » Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:05 pm

Just a reminder to anyone concerned.

Anyone violating these rules, may lose their posting privileges, or risk being banned for good.

5.  Do not use topics, or posts, for the sole purpose of criticizing an athlete, coach, fellow board member, or referee by name.  This is not fair to anybody because we are all anonymous users.

have a nice day!
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Postby ndbb » Tue Feb 28, 2006 2:48 pm

At The Devils Lake Jamestown game, the second string was launching three-pointers in a lets rub it in manner.
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Postby 4 Winds Indians Hoops Fan » Wed Mar 01, 2006 7:32 am

You are way off in saying that 4 winds starters were playing 2-3 quarters last year because thats just a flat out lie, I'd like to know how you came up with that figure.  I know those kids and Ironheart & Littlewind have been playing big varsity minutes for 3-4 years now and the rest are just getting big varsity minutes.  Besides 4 winds JV handles itself just fine and doesn't need to play varsity players.  I'd appreciate it if you didn't just make stuff up and throw it out in a public arena such as this because it shows desperation, desperation in trying to make a good program look bad.  So once again gimme proof even if it is in your personal accounts of the games, because to be honest I think you are telling bold faced lies and I'm gonna call you on it every time.

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Postby Irisheyes » Wed Mar 01, 2006 8:49 am

I'm not trying to deface the program or throw out desperate comments on a public forum.  I am not too familiar with all the kids but I was at two games last year and watched 2 kids play jv and then started the varsity game.  Why would I make that up.  Maybe someone was sick or quarters or who knows.  I do know when someone stands out greatly on JV and then watch them start the next game.  No big deal.  It was simply a statement.  Don't get bent out of shape.  RELAX.  They do have a great program and should be proud because they earned it.  Peace out.
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Postby hoopsfan » Wed Mar 01, 2006 12:31 pm

I know that everyone of us has seen a game where the dominant team was ahead plenty at the half, whether it be bball, fball, or any sport, only to see them blow it at the end.  And everybody ends up sayin' "how in the world could they have lost that game".  This is tournament time, people.  You lose one game, you go home!  You can't take the chance at half time of sitting your top players out because your ahead.  Even if the other team doesn't seem to be in the same caliber.  Every team gets hot.  And any team can be beaten.  Then there's the talk about the other team's feelings.  Well how do you think that other team would of felt if Rick would of sat his top players at the half?  Sort of demeaning, isn't it.  We teach our athletes to play their heart and souls our for the entire game, win or lose!  It makes no difference.  If it would have been a regular season game, I'm sure Rick would of sat his top players much earlier.  But this is tourney time and he's tryin' the best he can to get to state and I think it's about time that he and his boys get there.  Not only for them but for Rick's brothers who have spent time, money, effort and love teaching this group of kids the game of basketball and life.  Take it to the hoop boys, no matter what the score!!

mm
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Postby 4 Winds Indians Hoops Fan » Thu Mar 02, 2006 3:08 pm

Hoka!!
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