Hoopster Pre-season Top 40

[sportsphenom]

Just some context on the 3 out of state games that Enderlin plays.

Byron features 6'9" Ahjany Lee. At one point he had a Kansas offer and he is committed to St. Thomas.
Morris Area features 6'8" Jackson Loge. At one point he had offers from UND and Toledo, and he is committed to Augustana.
Canton features 6'8" junior Jacob Vande Weerd. I understand he is getting NAIA and Division 2 looks.

It would be challenging to find 3 North Dakota teams with quality 6'8" - 6'9" bigs. I would argue that it would be impossible to replicate that against ND teams without convincing the Class A schools to all do it. The Enderlin coaching staff also did a nice job in securing a scrimmage against Bismarck and Treysen Eaglestaff.


I have no idea if Enderlin will or will not win state this season. I feel envious of any person who got to watch Four Winds @ Enderlin in person.

Four Winds has so much offensive fire power and team speed, and wow are there some athletes. Deng Deng is super impressive athletically and I imagine he will have a plethora of schools going after him the next few years. Wow is Deng impressive. Yankton really stands out with his ability to score. Pearson and Left Bear are nice slashers and play makers.

Joe Hurlburt is a generational talent and I think he has a legitimate shot of playing in the NBA at some point in his life. Brian Qvale got very close and his skillset as a senior in high school was no where near the skillset that Joe utilizes.

What I loved about this game is all the "studs" showed up and did their thing and it was a battle to the last minute.

I think it says a lot for the depth and talent of Class B basketball that some of the generational talents it has produced are not even able to make it to the state tournament, most recently I would use Austin Dufault as this example.

You kind of proved some points here about not being a true "team". Yes Joe is a once in a lifetime athlete, but what about the rest of the Enderlin Eagles, don't you think they want to make it to state, something that after this year will be very hard to do. This isn't about making Joe better for college, have him live in the here and now of high school basketball. Yes in a few years all of this won't matter in the grand scheme of life, but there might be a lot of "what ifs". I hope for the small town of Enderlin they do make it to state but when all the focus is on Joe and his future I don't see that happening. Region 1 is always a dog fight and whomever comes out of it will be a legitimate contender for the state title.

[balla45]

I do not think I proved any point about Enderlin not being a true team. Joe had 27 points, 10 rebounds, and 9 assists and shot 10-16 from the field. I would argue that he played very well, his team played well, and he and his team lost to another very high caliber Class B team by 3 points.


If we are simply talking about the here and now of high school basketball.

I feel that a lot of players would like the opportunity to play non region games in fun venues against other top players. I feel that a lot of players would love to play on the main court at Sanford Pentagon. I would venture to state that those experiences will also be once in a lifetime opportunities for the majority of the players on their team.

I would have loved to have those opportunities when I was in high school. I commend Coach Kraft on creating these opportunities for his team.

It is obviously quite possible that Enderlin makes the state tournament and wins it. It is quite possible that they do not. Having a generational talent and playing a competitive and fun schedule, in my opinion, does more to improve their chances of winning a title, as compared to playing 3 additional games where they play against teams who are not as competitive as Byron, Morris Area, or Canton.

Having Joe Hurlburt be a generational talent and playing a fun schedule is not mutually exclusive with winning a state tournament.

Am I missing something?

[east sider]

Joe Hurlburt is a generational talent and I think he has a legitimate shot of playing in the NBA at some point in his life. Brian Qvale got very close and his skillset as a senior in high school was no where near the skillset that Joe utilizes.

What I loved about this game is all the "studs" showed up and did their thing and it was a battle to the last minute.

I think it says a lot for the depth and talent of Class B basketball that some of the generational talents it has produced are not even able to make it to the state tournament, most recently I would use Austin Dufault as this example.

I understand you're high on this kid's talent, but this isn't fair. You can't compare skillsets as they are different positions. Kretchman had a better skillset in HS along with numerous others, doesn't mean anything.

As this is a public forum I will not get into specifics, so I'll just say I strongly disagree with him having any legitimate shot at the NBA. Feel free to PM if you want to discuss.

I will criticize their coach, though. The last two years have been major disappointments in the post season. They stepped up their schedule but once again they are still sloppy with the ball and I question how good their defense is versus how good it could be. I'm not familiar with Dufault's situations, but pretty sure he didn't have the talent around him of Joe.

Coaching a player to develop into a D1 talent and coaching a team to state shouldn't be mutually exclusive. I predict they won't make state, losing to OG or Kindred, possibly CC. I hope I'm wrong, I really do. Sad as they might have the best player R1 has seen in 20 years.

[balla45]

Purely comparing Brian and Joe as high school seniors.

Brian Qvale is a 7'0" 5. Joe Hurlburt is a 6'11" 5.

I am not sure where Tanner Kretchman enters this conversation as a 6' guard.

Joe has more ability to stretch the floor and handle the basketball. He also can score over either shoulder with the hook or post fade. Brian as a high school player was the occasional straight line drive, but essentially everything was back to the basketball or on the offensive glass. I do not really think there is a debate here when comparing their high school skillsets. Please let me know if I am misremembering Brian as a high school player. One of my all time favorites and he has had a lot of professional success.

[east sider]

I would never list Joe as a 5, it's like saying Durant is a 5. I agree with your analysis of their skillsets. Brian was a traditional big - back to the basket, get rebounds, protect the rim. Joe will will never be that guy, thus I find it's useless to compare their skillsets and where each was at.

I will say one more thing: it's a long shot to become the best player at a D1 program and if you get that far it's still a long shot of getting to the pros.

[Flip]

I see ESPN has Joe listed as the #23 center. I agree with east sider he doesn't come off as a center to me.

I think he's a big underdog to play in the NBA. The NBA is a very good league, but I think he will have a good chance of playing professional basketball.

[balla45]

I think Joe Hurlburt is much closer to Nikola Jokic than Kevin Durant, so I would still list him as a 5. I do not find it useless to compare the skill sets of Joe and a back to the basket 5 who got very close to making it in a league that is almost all about switchabiliy and shot making, where back to the basket play is almost non existent.

I would venture to add that almost everyone not ranked in the top 10-15 in any individual class is an underdog to make it in the NBA. I feel that he has a legitimate shot of playing in the NBA at some point in his life and I fail to see where my statement is remotely outrageous. 6’11” athletic stretch than can guard 4-5 who will benefit immediately from collegiate strength and conditioning.

The Brian Qvale comparison is quite relevant. Some individuals seem to not understand that Joe could play the same role that Brian played, but Gus plays that role for the Enderlin team as their back to the basket guy.

[east sider]

I guess I don't see it, he doesn't have the frame/build of Brian Qvale. You really can't compare anyone to Jokic, he's so unique. And again, Jokic's build is too different. But I trust your judgement that he is more of a 5 than I give him credit for. I have seen him down low a few times and he has very nice touch.

"I would venture to add that almost everyone not ranked in the top 10-15 in any individual class is an underdog to make it in the NBA. I feel that he has a legitimate shot of playing in the NBA at some point in his life and I fail to see where my statement is remotely outrageous. 6’11” athletic stretch than can guard 4-5 who will benefit immediately from collegiate strength and conditioning."

I 100% agree with your first sentence, which is why I say it's not fair to say he has a legit shot of making the NBA. Maybe our argument is more semantics? He could benefit immensely from a good S&C program, it certainly won't hurt. I'd love to hear from those who have seen him and Dufault on regular occasions to see how they compare.

[Flip]

what do you think of this comparison?
Modern-day Brooke Lopez.

[east sider]

Well if you're asking me I would say your comparison is better than Jokic, but still too far off physically. Lopez is currently listed at 282 lbs. I don't ever see Joe getting to within 30 pounds of that. Plus Lopez was the best player on a very good Stanford team.

I guess I see his build as more of a Durant/Ingram type. At best fills out like Garnett or Davis. But those guys were like top 5 talent in HS so I hate to even compare. I don't see him playing much down low as the competition gets bigger, but I could be way off.

I think you're right that Joe could definitely be a pro, just not NBA pro. I've played a few guys who played overseas but likely were never close to the NBA. I've played 1 guy who made the NBA for about 5 minutes. The talent gap between playing overseas and the NBA end-of-bench player was pretty big. Either way I hope he proves me wrong.

[balla45]

I just think from a structural standpoint, a 6'11" 232 pound 18 year old has a lot of opportunity to gain 20-40 good pounds from a high level strength and conditioning program like Colorado will offer.

I have played against a few high school players who went on to play in the NBA and coached against several. I think he has all of the needed physical tools and a skillset that fits modern basketball. It is quite possible that Joe Hurlburt never plays in the NBA, but I believe he has a legitimate opportunity.

[Your daddy]

I wish kids nothing but success and won't talk down on them, but growing up I watched Mike Miller's high school teams dominate the highest level of south dakota basketball. Not only did he make his teammates better, but the competitiveness and drive I saw from him were off the charts compared to any player I've ever seen play. I don't see how you can talk NBA when enderlin didn't even make the state tournament last year. Miller's teams won 3 out of 4 state titles when he was in high school. Jmo

[balla45]

I attempt to not overvalue any one particular game.

As an example, Minnehaha Academy in the 2019-2020 season featured both Jalen Suggs and Chet Holmgren. They lost 1 game to Cretin Durham Hall.

They happened to lose that game early in the season. If they lose that game in a state qualifier, does that diminish their individual ability, or does it mean that their team lost a game?

How many high school state championships did Luka Garza win?


Also, using the specific Mike Miller example. Mike Miller was the 5th overall pick in the NBA draft, Rookie of the Year, and won 2 NBA titles.

I at no point have written that Joe Hurlburt will do that. I wrote that he has a legitimate chance of playing in the NBA. I will stand by that statement.

[The Schwab]

It seems like this is another post that has a lot of anti-Enderlin opinions again. Here are my opinions on what has been discussed:

1. Enderlin traveling to play these schools is a great thing for their community and school. How many teams have the opportunity to play that high level of competition? Not many at all.

2. Travel expenses to these games are very minor compared to other ways that our state spends money. Also, the percentage that comes from the tax payers of their district IMO would be very welcomed by the majority of patrons on the school. I would assume that most of their taxpayers are older than average and there is nothing that the older generation likes talking about more than a good sports team. There isn't much like a good sports team to bring a community together.

3. How many players in ND have went to a power 5 school on an athletic scholarship? IMO Joe will make money playing professional basketball, how many North Dakotans can say that? Does it matter if it's in the NBA or a top overseas league? IMO not at all. Does he have a chance to play in the NBA? Yes, I believe he does.

[defensewinsgames]

The two things guaranteed to make people talk on this board:

1. Class System/Classification
2. Enderlin Boys Basketball/Joe Hurlburt

[WalkingStick]

The two things guaranteed to make people talk on this board:

1. Class System/Classification
2. Enderlin Boys Basketball/Joe Hurlburt

3. Anti-Private school

[itsallabouteddie]

Just some context on the 3 out of state games that Enderlin plays.

Byron features 6'9" Ahjany Lee. At one point he had a Kansas offer and he is committed to St. Thomas.
Morris Area features 6'8" Jackson Loge. At one point he had offers from UND and Toledo, and he is committed to Augustana.
Canton features 6'8" junior Jacob Vande Weerd. I understand he is getting NAIA and Division 2 looks.

It would be challenging to find 3 North Dakota teams with quality 6'8" - 6'9" bigs. I would argue that it would be impossible to replicate that against ND teams without convincing the Class A schools to all do it. The Enderlin coaching staff also did a nice job in securing a scrimmage against Bismarck and Treysen Eaglestaff.


I have no idea if Enderlin will or will not win state this season. I feel envious of any person who got to watch Four Winds @ Enderlin in person.

Four Winds has so much offensive fire power and team speed, and wow are there some athletes. Deng Deng is super impressive athletically and I imagine he will have a plethora of schools going after him the next few years. Wow is Deng impressive. Yankton really stands out with his ability to score. Pearson and Left Bear are nice slashers and play makers.

Joe Hurlburt is a generational talent and I think he has a legitimate shot of playing in the NBA at some point in his life. Brian Qvale got very close and his skillset as a senior in high school was no where near the skillset that Joe utilizes.

What I loved about this game is all the "studs" showed up and did their thing and it was a battle to the last minute.

I think it says a lot for the depth and talent of Class B basketball that some of the generational talents it has produced are not even able to make it to the state tournament, most recently I would use Austin Dufault as this example.

Ahjany Lee transferred to Totino Grace. He did not play in this game.

[balla45]

Saw that he transferred. Would have been a fun match up.

TG has a really impressive roster.

[hoophoophoop]

It seems like this is another post that has a lot of anti-Enderlin opinions again. Here are my opinions on what has been discussed:

1. Enderlin traveling to play these schools is a great thing for their community and school. How many teams have the opportunity to play that high level of competition? Not many at all.

2. Travel expenses to these games are very minor compared to other ways that our state spends money. Also, the percentage that comes from the tax payers of their district IMO would be very welcomed by the majority of patrons on the school. I would assume that most of their taxpayers are older than average and there is nothing that the older generation likes talking about more than a good sports team. There isn't much like a good sports team to bring a community together.

3. How many players in ND have went to a power 5 school on an athletic scholarship? IMO Joe will make money playing professional basketball, how many North Dakotans can say that? Does it matter if it's in the NBA or a top overseas league? IMO not at all. Does he have a chance to play in the NBA? Yes, I believe he does.

NBA, oh my words, great talent but really NBA, I seen the 4_winds game in person, Deng Deng was the best player on the court!! There are a a lot of people on this website that bash on Enderlin, but it is well deserved, just got another Technical in the Lisbon game again, they are quite the class act!! I've never heard of a team getting as many technicals as they do, just kinda bugs me the way the act out on the court, and I mean the whole team!!!

[The Schwab]

Deng Deng is a very good player who I think will have a lot of college offers but to say he is the best player that was playing in that game is a stretch. Joe H was a highly recruited individual who will play at a power 5 program. I can't say that he will play in the NBA, but at the same time you can't say that he won't.

[maddog1971]

Didn't Enderlin get it handed to them in MN? I heard 15 to 20 and it was not that close. NOW they have to take on Sargent County??? maybe they go 1 and 3 to start the year....

By the way I think Enderlin gets grief on here so much because they are so hyped up all the time with people talking about the NBA players on this team and all the talent and then when you watch them.... very good ND class B team but not even close to the hype people talk about. Also not a fan of the attitude shown on the floor and the T's and also running up the scores on teams. IF Enderlin wins by 40 points and Joe has 40 for the game.... that is just wrong....

[justplayalready]

A lot more Deng's in the NBA than Hurlburt's..LOL The pedigree is already there...

[The Schwab]

I remember a North Dakota where people would root for ND athletes to have success. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore. I hope Enderlin makes it to state this year and wins the whole thing. The amount of criticism they have endured over the last few years borders on ridiculous.

[WalkingStick]

I remember a North Dakota where people would root for ND athletes to have success. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore. I hope Enderlin makes it to state this year and wins the whole thing. The amount of criticism they have endured over the last few years borders on ridiculous.

Agreed (on the criticism standpoint). I'd like to see Enderlin get there as they haven't been to state in quite awhile; this is their year to knock off the 'big boys' from R1.

Right now it is:
Tier 1a: Kindred/Enderlin - Even

Tier 1b: Central Cass

Tier 2:
Northern Cass
Sargent County
Oak Grove

Rest of Region

[balla45]

Is it really surprising that the most highly recruited male North Dakota high school basketball player this century would get hype on a Class B sports forum? It is almost comical to me that some of us want to pretend that the ability is not there when he is signed at Colorado and had a plethora of other high major offers that most players can only dream of. Joe essentially plays combo guard in high school due to the needs of the their team. I think several will be surprised at the things he can do on the block, in the mid post, and out of the pick and pop. When I say needs of their team, in my opinion, it is advantageous to play both Joe and Gus together as much as possible for their team. As spacing would typically not have 2 players occupy the block, and Joe has a more advanced perimeter game than Gus, it makes a lot of sense, to me, for that team to have Gus occupy the block and the rest of the team make plays from the perimeter and space off of Gus.

Just a few replies to previous posters.

Joe Hurlburt did not have 40 against Lisbon. Even if he would have, what is an acceptable number to have against an overmatched team?

Deng Deng is very impressive.

Byron is a nice team. They were up 10 at the half. Was a fairly competitive game that stretched out to 16 at the end.