Season Suspension

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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Flip » Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:13 pm

woodchuck10 wrote:Class B basketball a district schedule only play each team twice, or a region schedule play everyone once. Regions will look like volleyball with home courts being used. I also think no games will be played until January. No fans at all I'm guessing until Regionals if cases look better.

How about playing everyone in your region one time? No districts, just a region tournament. Everyone makes the tournament.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Bisonguy06 » Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:48 pm

I might be alone on an island here, but I’m going to go with it anyway.

The virus has been the lead story in the country virtually every day for eight months. Cases are trending upward across the country, despite (self-reported) mask wearing also being at an all time high. We’ve been limiting crowd sizes, scaling back some events, canceling others outright, and encouraging social distancing like never before.

The question: are we sure we can stop this virus in its tracks with the new measures or any others? Are we sure that the masses have been irresponsibly spreading the virus?

My answer: We are not entirely powerless, but for the most part, the virus is gonna virus. Giant sacrifices have been made by many. There is a degree of asymptomatic spread among people in essential activities. And in some places, the blame game has gone way too far.

What does this mean for winter sports? I shrug my shoulders.

I appreciate coaches going to bat for their kids and their programs. I do not appreciate the sentiment that “we are here because our neighbors have behaved selfishly.”

Before the virus came along, I think we would have universally agreed that athletics are a net positive for public health. I don’t think the virus changes that one bit. If I ruled the world, we would shelter the vulnerable, we would respect those who opt out. School would meet, the kids would play ball this winter with common sense modifications, and we would stop the blame game.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby north1 » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:23 pm

Man that is one of the best posts I have seen on any forum. I wish you ruled the world. Not just because I really want to see the kids play sports either. Heck I would pay $100/month till end of season to watch a smattering of games across the state. Like an expanded BEK TV deal.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby B-oldtimer » Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:09 pm

The fact is nobody is going to put the Jeannie back in the bottle for us in the US or that matter the world. We are going to have to live with this virus until we are either immune or built up resistance to this Virus. This current new high numbers is what a virus does it spreads through out the population. The problem with this virus is that greatest threat is to people is people over 60 years of age and highest threat is the oldest people in our population. Second is that is also a threat to people with preexisting conditions. Now we get this latest numbers daily scaring heck out of everyone but if you look at the numbers here in North dakota we are only now reaching confirmed cases of Covid-19 in range of between 8 and 9% of the population of North dakota. Since the Start of Covid-19 at this pace we are going to take almost 10 years for everyone to have had it build some resistance to this Virus and it may be like common cold it can come back again and again. We may develop a vaccine for this or we may never develop totally successful vaccine and if this case were going to have to live with this threat. I look at recent numbers on Covid-19 if your under 70 years of age your survival rate for Covid-19 is 99.7% which is quite good but the numbers drop after that older you get and more health issues you have. The question we as country and as adults is were going to have to live with risk and manage how much exposure we have to this virus. Health experts say only way we get through this when we get heard immunity to this virus but this means majority of us will have had caught this virus and got through it. Another important factor is young people are best able to fight this virus but with all viruses it still risk to certain individuals but very low number. I think as society we need to decide how much exposure or how many people we can have sick at one time so we can take care of these people and ensure they have good chance to survive this virus. I know i am going to hear we can knock this virus out with lockdowns and facemasks but were just fooling ourselves because if were going to survive people need to interact for basic needs and we need to work and make living so we can daily life we have come known and to have a healthy mental life and same goes for our children. The world has tried lockdown and masks but the Virus just continues its natural course of spreading through the population and it can't be stopped anymore. I believe its time for us develop a plan on how were going to live normal life with Covid-19 as a risk and how we can protect most vulnerable of us until we have heard immunity and Vaccine that can also reduce the risk to most vulnerable. Also our health providers may need to revaluate how much hospital capacity they need for Covid-19 and we may need to ramp up numbers people needed to working in our health system. WE have seen steady decline in basic care over last generation with new drugs and medical innovation but we may have gone to far in this now will have to start valuing the need for skilled nursing and general practice physicians so we can help people through this difficult time to fight this virus. These are my thoughts but our kids need to get back to normal life or were going to start paying dear price its effecting their mental welfare and health more than Covid-19 is affecting their health.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Flip » Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:30 pm

It's called "herd immunity."
Lots of good news with vaccines in the past couple of weeks too. Sounds like there will be 20 million doses available in December to the most vulnerable.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Run4Fun2009 » Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:15 pm

I see, tonight, a HS School Board in NW ND voted to refuse to follow the mandate and not wear masks in the school or during the school day.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby defensewinsgames » Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:55 am

Run4Fun2009 wrote:I see, tonight, a HS School Board in NW ND voted to refuse to follow the mandate and not wear masks in the school or during the school day.


Now this is the stuff that just doesn't make sense to me...Let's assume that the science deniers are right and masks are minimally effective or almost non-effective. Doesn't it still make sense to wear them if there is even a tiny chance it helps at all? Isn't potentially protecting even a single human life worth it? My heart is sad not only for our athletes and kids but for humanity as a whole. I pray this division, hate, and anger in our state and country comes to an end soon.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby BasketballMind » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:38 am

defensewinsgames wrote:
Run4Fun2009 wrote:I see, tonight, a HS School Board in NW ND voted to refuse to follow the mandate and not wear masks in the school or during the school day.


Now this is the stuff that just doesn't make sense to me...Let's assume that the science deniers are right and masks are minimally effective or almost non-effective. Doesn't it still make sense to wear them if there is even a tiny chance it helps at all? Isn't potentially protecting even a single human life worth it? My heart is sad not only for our athletes and kids but for humanity as a whole. I pray this division, hate, and anger in our state and country comes to an end soon.


I now present you the response to this argument that most people in the camp you are describing will say.

"If masks work, what difference does it make if you wear one, but I do not?"
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:59 am

Let’s be precise in our language. The school board voted that masks would be “recommended and not mandatory.”

I bet there would be science in favor of education being better when you can see the facial expression of your teacher or a fellow student.

Science might tell us that physical distance is more important than masking.

Science might tell us something about the ability, or inability, of young elementary students to wear a mask properly.

I’ve been masking in every situation where I can’t social distance for the last couple months. I would not defy a governor or school policy. I WOULD like to see better, clearer evidence that “masks work”.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby defensewinsgames » Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:10 am

BasketballMind wrote:
defensewinsgames wrote:
Run4Fun2009 wrote:I see, tonight, a HS School Board in NW ND voted to refuse to follow the mandate and not wear masks in the school or during the school day.


Now this is the stuff that just doesn't make sense to me...Let's assume that the science deniers are right and masks are minimally effective or almost non-effective. Doesn't it still make sense to wear them if there is even a tiny chance it helps at all? Isn't potentially protecting even a single human life worth it? My heart is sad not only for our athletes and kids but for humanity as a whole. I pray this division, hate, and anger in our state and country comes to an end soon.


I now present you the response to this argument that most people in the camp you are describing will say.

"If masks work, what difference does it make if you wear one, but I do not?"


My response would be that I assume this is the "herd immunity" crowd as well. Think of masks like you think of the disease and herd immunity. If 1/2 of us (or less) are wearing them it won't protect those of you who aren't from getting it, spreading, bringing it into our homes when we don't have them on. The herd depends on all being protected to prevent incubation and growth of the disease (see all of the diseases popping up for the first time in generations on the west coast because of a rise in anti-vaccinators - great example of how personal choices impact the group). If every business on a street does what it can to prevent a fire but one owner burns garbage on the back patio on a windy day, the whole block may burn down regardless of how safe some people were. With the interconnectedness of humanity at this point we all depend on each other for many things, one of which is the spread of disease and public health. I say this fully understanding for a lot of people this isn't an issue of science so no matter what I or others tell you it won't make a difference; but I feel compelled to respond anyway so this is how I would answer those people.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... -cov2.html
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Run4Fun2009 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:36 am

Bisonguy06 wrote:Let’s be precise in our language. The school board voted that masks would be “recommended and not mandatory.”

I bet there would be science in favor of education being better when you can see the facial expression of your teacher or a fellow student.

Science might tell us that physical distance is more important than masking.

Science might tell us something about the ability, or inability, of young elementary students to wear a mask properly.

I’ve been masking in every situation where I can’t social distance for the last couple months. I would not defy a governor or school policy. I WOULD like to see better, clearer evidence that “masks work”.


Yep, that’s on me...posted off word of a source. Saw the tweet with that description in it this AM
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby The Schwab » Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:48 am

BasketballMind wrote:
defensewinsgames wrote:
Run4Fun2009 wrote:I see, tonight, a HS School Board in NW ND voted to refuse to follow the mandate and not wear masks in the school or during the school day.


Now this is the stuff that just doesn't make sense to me...Let's assume that the science deniers are right and masks are minimally effective or almost non-effective. Doesn't it still make sense to wear them if there is even a tiny chance it helps at all? Isn't potentially protecting even a single human life worth it? My heart is sad not only for our athletes and kids but for humanity as a whole. I pray this division, hate, and anger in our state and country comes to an end soon.


I now present you the response to this argument that most people in the camp you are describing will say.

"If masks work, what difference does it make if you wear one, but I do not?"


Masks help prevent the spreading of the virus by limiting the discharge of the virus by an infected person (Coughing, sneezing, saliva etc...). Masks are not effective at preventing all of the ingesting of the discharge from an infected individual. Therefore, I wear my mask to protect you and you wear yours to protect me. If everyone wears one the rate at which the virus spreads would drop greatly. If only a percentage of people wear one, it will not significantly decrease the rate at which we spread the virus (unless all of the infected individuals were wearing one).
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby The Schwab » Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:55 am

north1 wrote:With everyone wearing masks now this will be well under control in a month. Just hope there is enough time to get everything and everyone up to speed.


Not everyone is wearing masks now. Multiples sheriffs departments have made the statements that they will not be enforcing this mandate because it isn't a law.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:57 am

Is the virus trending downward in places around the country with mandatory masking and enforcement?
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby packers21 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:03 pm

Bisonguy06 wrote:Is the virus trending downward in places around the country with mandatory masking and enforcement?


No, I do no think so.
It is a little harder to motivate kids I guess because they’ve been pampered so much. We’re in the trophy generation, give ‘em a trophy for 23rd place, make ‘em feel good. Make mom and dad feel good.” Tom Izzo, Michigan State Basketball
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby The Schwab » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:07 pm

Bisonguy06 wrote:Is the virus trending downward in places around the country with mandatory masking and enforcement?


I'm sure that you know just as well as I do that there are multiple studies on the issue, some with positive impacts and some with no impacts. The only way we can truly stop the spread is wearing masks when you are within 6 feet of anyone who doesn't live in the same residence as you.

I know that there are a lot of people who wear masks when they are at grocery stores and out shopping in public. Do those same people wear masks when they are within 6 feet of anyone who doesn't live in the same residence as them? My guess would be not

The fact of the matter is there are studies out there on both sides of 99.99% of the issues that are controversial, so you will be able to find one to back up your beliefs. I have decided to follow the majority of doctors and people who study infectious diseases.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:22 pm

Correct, and I will be masking in every situation where I cannot distance, whether mandated or not.

Though I have no platform, if I did, I won’t communicate that universal masking will definitely stop the spread. That message might actually be counterproductive and might lead people to falsely believe they are safe.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby The Schwab » Tue Nov 17, 2020 12:44 pm

Bisonguy06 wrote:Correct, and I will be masking in every situation where I cannot distance, whether mandated or not.

Though I have no platform, if I did, I won’t communicate that universal masking will definitely stop the spread. That message might actually be counterproductive and might lead people to falsely believe they are safe.


I should have picked my words better. I should have said that if we wear masks anytime we are within 6 feet of someone we don't live in the same residence as, we will significantly reduce the spread. With anything viral I don't know if we can 100% stop the spread.

How I feel about masks:
1. If I go into a room with 20 people (not able to be 6' apart) and I'm the only one wearing a mask, my odds of getting the virus have not decreased a significant amount.
2. If I go into a room with 20 people (not able to be 6' apart) and half of the people are wearing a mask, my odds of getting the virus have decreased
3. If I go into a room with 20 people (not able to be 6' apart) and everyone in the room is wearing a mask, my odds of getting the virus have decreased greatly.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:07 pm

We essentially agree on masks, and only differ slightly on the verbiage that should be used to promote wearing them.

I have a different and half baked theory on how we arrived at the suspension of winter sports. It goes something like this:

1) The hospitals are telling Governor Burgum that this is serious. (It is.)
2) Our state’s color-coded baby steps haven’t worked. (They haven’t.)
3) The only way that Burgum believes he can bring attention to the seriousness is to pull the plug on high school sports.

I think he has prescribed the wrong medicine. I wish it didn’t have to come to this. But he might be right that it took this step to grab our attention.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby The Schwab » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:19 pm

100% agree with you.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby defensewinsgames » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:32 pm

Bisonguy06 wrote:We essentially agree on masks, and only differ slightly on the verbiage that should be used to promote wearing them.

I have a different and half baked theory on how we arrived at the suspension of winter sports. It goes something like this:

1) The hospitals are telling Governor Burgum that this is serious. (It is.)
2) Our state’s color-coded baby steps haven’t worked. (They haven’t.)
3) The only way that Burgum believes he can bring attention to the seriousness is to pull the plug on high school sports.

I think he has prescribed the wrong medicine. I wish it didn’t have to come to this. But he might be right that it took this step to grab our attention.


I totally agree with this. I worry the general public doesn't understand the point we are in terms of hospitals and medical staff shortage. To say we are in a terrible spot doesn't do the situation justice.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby Run4Fun2009 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:46 pm

Rumor has it MN is going to do the same soon...suspension likely to 2021
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby BasketballMind » Tue Nov 17, 2020 3:08 pm

My response would be that I assume this is the "herd immunity" crowd as well. Think of masks like you think of the disease and herd immunity. If 1/2 of us (or less) are wearing them it won't protect those of you who aren't from getting it, spreading, bringing it into our homes when we don't have them on. The herd depends on all being protected to prevent incubation and growth of the disease (see all of the diseases popping up for the first time in generations on the west coast because of a rise in anti-vaccinators - great example of how personal choices impact the group). If every business on a street does what it can to prevent a fire but one owner burns garbage on the back patio on a windy day, the whole block may burn down regardless of how safe some people were. With the interconnectedness of humanity at this point we all depend on each other for many things, one of which is the spread of disease and public health. I say this fully understanding for a lot of people this isn't an issue of science so no matter what I or others tell you it won't make a difference; but I feel compelled to respond anyway so this is how I would answer those people.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... -cov2.html


To be clear, I am not saying that, but when this has been the main story every day for 9 months, you get used to what people will say in these arguments. The same argument is made for vaccines.
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby B-oldtimer » Tue Nov 17, 2020 4:42 pm

I am going to say something about the masks that may not be popular but for most people only type is having n-95 masks be worn because is the only mask available to public that would be fairly effective to stop the virus from going through your mask into your body. Second is even these mask need to be changed through the day to be effective. The cloth masks most people are wearing stop very little of virus and if they do are collector enough if touched by person wearing masks just hastens chance of infecting your self. Then add in if masks don't fit your face and there is leakage around the masks stopping the effectiveness of the mask and renders it ineffective. It may even make it worse because now you have your breath going by your eyes which is one of major areas where Covid -19 enters your body. Now from my personal observation about masks people are constantly touching there masks either adjusting them or lifting them to have free airflow then touching there faces or again around there eyes again which again is one leading areas for the virus to enter your body. People working in Hospital setting change there masks frequently to maintain sanitary conditions but this is not possible in day to day living and working conditions in the real world. If you read what they recommended about masks before it became politicized this past year effectiveness of masks had little to no effect in stop of spreading viruses. This was official opinion of CDC until we had politics come into play again and was even advised to on television. Distancing and limiting social contact will reduce how fast this virus spreads but the fact is its going to work its way through the population now no matter what we do it just how fast it does. The hospitals, Doctors, politicians, and public need a plan how much resources will be needed until we have reach point of herd immunity. I believe there is large group of people that think we can make this virus disappear but that is not possible anymore. This is a virus were going to have to live with and there will be risks from it especially for us older generation because its of much higher risks to us surviving this virus than younger people. The vaccines in development may be the way to reduce these risks but we won't know how effective they will be and long term effectiveness they will have against the virus. I think people are just looking for magical fix that will stop us from catching this virus but truth is were sooner or later going to catch this virus but my hope is that I will be able to fight it off and survive having it .
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Re: Season Suspension

Postby classB4ever » Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:32 pm

Fear mongering is what our current politics are about. For over 60 years our educators have taught our children our world is coming to an end. First it was global warming. Then it was global cooling. Then it was global warming again. Then it was global cooling again. Then they changed it to climate change. For decades they have scared our young into becoming activists for ridiculous reasons. All the while the people who claim these ridiculous statements don’t live by what they claim. Wake up.
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