Top Teams and Players

The teams in Class A

Postby B » Wed Jan 24, 2007 4:27 am

baller01 wrote:
B wrote:
bballfan_05 wrote:I'm not sure on who is going into that region for sure, but I think wishek and sd are going back to 9man if I remember right. That might take a couple of easy wins away from some of these teams

"Easy wins"??  Let's see......what team beat Linton in 2004 and 2005???  Nice post!!  Way to do your homework.

Steele won in 2004 and 2005. Before that, they hadn't won in about 28 years. Their record over the past 30 years against Imdieke's Lions is something like 28-2.
So evidently NO ONE else in the state had a "decent" team either.  Who had a better record against them the past 10 years??? 
B
 

Postby B » Wed Jan 24, 2007 7:59 am

bballfan_05 wrote:
B wrote:
bballfan_05 wrote:I'm not sure on who is going into that region for sure, but I think wishek and sd are going back to 9man if I remember right. That might take a couple of easy wins away from some of these teams

"Easy wins"??  Let's see......what team beat Linton in 2004 and 2005???  Nice post!!  Way to do your homework.
Yea they beat linton the ONLY years they actually had a team. What happened this year, they got creamed. Besides 2004 and 2005, when has SD even had a decent team. Thats what i thought


Depends upon what your definition of "decent" would be.  That Region was awfully good for alot of years.  (Many State Championships) I believe the 4 seed even beat 1 seeds from other regions a couple of years.  Steele was usually right below .500  Even this year 3 teams from that "old" region played for a State Title, TL-M, Linton, Napoleon.   Wishek had an awful run for quit a while but they've played some good ball the past 2 years and knocked off a couple of good teams.  I still think that's a very uniformed statement.

And to make sure everyone knows...  I am not knocking Linton, they have a great program, they are coached well, and they seem to get all their athletes to play football.
B
 

Postby baseball » Wed Jan 24, 2007 8:03 am

B wrote:And to make sure everyone knows...  I am not knocking Linton, they have a great program, they are coached well, and they seem to get all their athletes to play football.

thats probably the reason he said Steele would be an easy win.  this past year the best athletes in the school didnt play so that doesnt help the coaches when that happens.
Pay Heed, All Who Enter: Beware of "The Phog"
baseball
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 4641
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:53 pm

Postby bballfan_05 » Wed Jan 24, 2007 9:34 am

baseball wrote:
B wrote:And to make sure everyone knows...  I am not knocking Linton, they have a great program, they are coached well, and they seem to get all their athletes to play football.

thats probably the reason he said Steele would be an easy win.  this past year the best athletes in the school didnt play so that doesnt help the coaches when that happens.
Exactly, I don't know if this is the case their, but it's hard to get the best athletes in the school to play if they don't have any respect for the coaches. Again, I don't know if this is the case their or not, but it's something you hear about in schools all the time.
User avatar
bballfan_05
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:01 pm

Postby comet001 » Thu Jan 25, 2007 6:24 pm

how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games
comet001
NDPreps Rookie
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 2:33 pm

Postby bballfan_05 » Thu Jan 25, 2007 7:26 pm

comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games
If the coaches get along with the players instead of being arrogant and trying to act like they are in high school again.
User avatar
bballfan_05
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:01 pm

Postby B » Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:04 am

comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games

Well you can't be from S-D or you would know better.  (Unless you base your posts on 1 season.)  So therefore you must play football in a very good program.  So where do you play???
B
 

Postby bballfan_05 » Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:03 pm

B wrote:
comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games

Well you can't be from S-D or you would know better.  (Unless you base your posts on 1 season.)  So therefore you must play football in a very good program.  So where do you play???

Um.... idk what the deal is there, but i know they went 1-7 after having two teams go to the playoffs. Yes, every team loses good players and has to rebuild. However, it also comes down to coaching in many aspects and being to adapt to their players that given year. Often, some coaches try to run the same offense year after year when they don't have the personal to do it. Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year.
User avatar
bballfan_05
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:01 pm

Postby B » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:16 am

bballfan_05 wrote:
B wrote:
comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games

Well you can't be from S-D or you would know better.  (Unless you base your posts on 1 season.)  So therefore you must play football in a very good program.  So where do you play???

Um.... idk what the deal is there, but i know they went 1-7 after having two teams go to the playoffs. Yes, every team loses good players and has to rebuild. However, it also comes down to coaching in many aspects and being to adapt to their players that given year. Often, some coaches try to run the same offense year after year when they don't have the personal to do it. Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year.

"Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year."


You obviously have ZERO coaching experience!!!

In the smaller schools you will most likely have some years where either injuries can hurt you, or you don't have many kids (like playing 11-man with about 21-23 kids) or you might have a bunch of underclassmen (which is ok in other sports, football is NOT one of them) or you just might have kids that aren't very physical.  This doesn't mean they are "bad" kids but any of these or a combination of these things will be awfully hard on a football teams record.     

Even in recent years (past 6?) Turtle Lake and Edgeley-Kulm have had 2 win seasons.  Personally I think they have good coaches.  I can think of some very good coaches that had great teams 8-15 years ago but because of shrinking enrollments they haven't been able to compete for awhile.  Do I think all of their kids that they have ever coached think "highly" of them?  NO!!  That is not the main point of coaching because you are never going to make everyone happy.

Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
B
 

Postby Shocker » Fri Feb 02, 2007 10:58 am

[user=87]B[/user] wrote:
Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
I don't know if I completely understand what you mean by you "have to hang your hat on something," but if I am interpreting what you are saying correctly, I have to disagree. The New England Patriots don't "hang their hats" on a particular style, they choose a style each week to expliot mismatches. Now, I'm certainly not saying that a North Dakota HS team could have an offense as complex as theirs, but I do think they could run an offense with major changes from week to week. Also, changes would probably be easier on the defensive side of the ball. It could be as easy as switching from a base 4-4, to a base 3-4, or 5-2 against certain teams. If the other team doesn't know what to prepare for, it will be much easier to beat them.
Shocker
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:21 am

Postby ND_Coach » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:47 pm

Shocker wrote:[user=87]B[/user] wrote:
Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
I don't know if I completely understand what you mean by you "have to hang your hat on something," but if I am interpreting what you are saying correctly, I have to disagree. The New England Patriots don't "hang their hats" on a particular style, they choose a style each week to expliot mismatches. Now, I'm certainly not saying that a North Dakota HS team could have an offense as complex as theirs, but I do think they could run an offense with major changes from week to week. Also, changes would probably be easier on the defensive side of the ball. It could be as easy as switching from a base 4-4, to a base 3-4, or 5-2 against certain teams. If the other team doesn't know what to prepare for, it will be much easier to beat them.


I think in the case of the Patriots they take what the other teams gives them, if the opponent loads the box they spread it and throw, if they go nickle and dime, time to run the ball, that is their offensive philosophy.  There are NFL teams that do have a distinct style they "hang their hat on" Pittsburgs power running game, Chicagos great defense, Denvers zone running game, the Vikings not scoring at all and losing (sorry couldn't resist).  At that level they have offensive systems, where it may appear to be hundreds of plays and formations, but is adaptations to offensive concepts.

I think if you are making major changes to your offense every week you will not be winning many football games.  If you have to make major changes it is for one of two reasons.  1: Injuries have devasted your team.  2: You screwed up big time earlier in the year designing a scheme for your team.  Either situation is not good.  That being said good teams will add new wrinkles to the game plan, say a set of 4-5 plays for certain situations, but these are not major changes to their philosophy.

I would tend to agree more with B's take.  The better high school football teams will have a base offensive philosophy, but then also make adjustments.  Bloomington, the team that holds the national scoring record for a season scored over 900 points using one formation (The Double Wing) and six plays.  DeLaSalle who had the longest winning streak runs the simple split back veer, but it is repped to perfection.  Those teams take what they know and believe in and make it work. 
Last edited by ND_Coach on Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ND_Coach
NDPreps All-Conference
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:45 am

Postby bballfan_05 » Fri Feb 02, 2007 6:12 pm

Shocker wrote:[user=87]B[/user] wrote:
Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
I don't know if I completely understand what you mean by you "have to hang your hat on something," but if I am interpreting what you are saying correctly, I have to disagree. The New England Patriots don't "hang their hats" on a particular style, they choose a style each week to expliot mismatches. Now, I'm certainly not saying that a North Dakota HS team could have an offense as complex as theirs, but I do think they could run an offense with major changes from week to week. Also, changes would probably be easier on the defensive side of the ball. It could be as easy as switching from a base 4-4, to a base 3-4, or 5-2 against certain teams. If the other team doesn't know what to prepare for, it will be much easier to beat them.
EXACTLY MY POINT!!!! Yes, you don't need to make that big of changes, but one should change things up and not run the same thing year after year according to your personel. This is one thing that separates the GREAT COACHES from the AVERAGE COACH. Sometimes you need to bite the bullet and realize that what you are teaching isn't what is best for your players. FYI you don't need to be a coach to realize that, it should be common knowledge...
User avatar
bballfan_05
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:01 pm

Postby baseball » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:44 pm

B wrote:
bballfan_05 wrote:
B wrote:
comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games

Well you can't be from S-D or you would know better.  (Unless you base your posts on 1 season.)  So therefore you must play football in a very good program.  So where do you play???

Um.... idk what the deal is there, but i know they went 1-7 after having two teams go to the playoffs. Yes, every team loses good players and has to rebuild. However, it also comes down to coaching in many aspects and being to adapt to their players that given year. Often, some coaches try to run the same offense year after year when they don't have the personal to do it. Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year.

"Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year."


You obviously have ZERO coaching experience!!!

In the smaller schools you will most likely have some years where either injuries can hurt you, or you don't have many kids (like playing 11-man with about 21-23 kids) or you might have a bunch of underclassmen (which is ok in other sports, football is NOT one of them) or you just might have kids that aren't very physical.  This doesn't mean they are "bad" kids but any of these or a combination of these things will be awfully hard on a football teams record.     

Even in recent years (past 6?) Turtle Lake and Edgeley-Kulm have had 2 win seasons.  Personally I think they have good coaches.  I can think of some very good coaches that had great teams 8-15 years ago but because of shrinking enrollments they haven't been able to compete for awhile.  Do I think all of their kids that they have ever coached think "highly" of them?  NO!!  That is not the main point of coaching because you are never going to make everyone happy.

Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.

well a good coach also knows what position to put players at. your sayin steele dawson has a great program because they beat linton twice and go to the playoffs for 2 years?  some coaches will realize that the option doesnt work when your RB is a 3 year lineman playin in the backfield only his senior year...who were imdikes star players for linton this last year when they went to the state championship, 3rd string QB, no carr, no bodvig....hes a great coach who won with the team he had.
Pay Heed, All Who Enter: Beware of "The Phog"
baseball
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 4641
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:53 pm

Postby ND_Coach » Sat Feb 03, 2007 4:18 am

Linton had a huge verteran offensive line, that is a big reason as to why they were able to have success
Last edited by ND_Coach on Sat Feb 03, 2007 4:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
ND_Coach
NDPreps All-Conference
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:45 am

Postby B » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:01 am

ND_Coach wrote:Linton had a huge verteran offensive line, that is a big reason as to why they were able to have success


Very true....They had  big roster with lots of well coached athletes.

Back to "Baseball",

I pretty sure no one ever said Steele has a "great" football program, that's pretty obvious when all the kids aren't playing and they just had a 1-7 year.

Out of interest, what offense would have worked for the Pirates this past season??? (iso right, iso left, sweep rt, sweep left????) What kids needed to play where??? 

Don't you think a certain 3rd year lineman made himself into a pretty good athlete to have a shot at fullback.  Seems like lineman move to fullback fairly often from what I've seen.

Actually I'm done with this post.... to many comments and not enough facts.
B
 

Postby baseball » Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:17 am

true lineman do move to fullback but why would they do it with Nick Lang and not Steve Berreth???  put him at center....good job. who could stop him and Scherbenske out of the backfield.  why wasnt Bakkum QB in an option offense with Heins and Hetletved wide with Ochsner Berreth and Scherbenke is the backfield?

Steele had argueably two of the most athletic classes back to back for them 2 years, thats why they had success.  go with the baseball team for example, did Silbernagel teach that team everything or did they learn it all playing Little League and Babe Ruth......ill go with #2
Last edited by baseball on Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
Pay Heed, All Who Enter: Beware of "The Phog"
baseball
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 4641
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:53 pm

Postby AR » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:06 am

baseball wrote:true lineman do move to fullback but why would they do it with Nick Lang and not Steve Berreth???  put him at center....good job. who could stop him and Scherbenske out of the backfield.  why wasnt Bakkum QB in an option offense with Heins and Hetletved wide with Ochsner Berreth and Scherbenke is the backfield?

Steele had argueably two of the most athletic classes back to back for them 2 years, thats why they had success.  go with the baseball team for example, did Silbernagel teach that team everything or did they learn it all playing Little League and Babe Ruth......ill go with #2


1.  What team are you talking about???  The previous post was referring to the 06 team, over half the kids you mentioned have graduated and they did make the playoffs when they played. They had a very good run in 04, had some key injuries. They lost to Cavalier as seniors I believe.  (As did a "few" other good teams.)

2.  Yes Bakkum could have been an outstanding option QB if he liked football.  He didn't even play this past season.  If you ever watched him play he was very gifted in football but his heart wasn't in it.

3.  If your saying that you need good players to win alot of games in  I'm sure everyone agrees. 

4.  Football coaches generally like to put a big, strong player or two or FIVE on the line. (Berreth kid)

5.  If you honestly believe Steele's baseball coach has had nothing to do with their success you're just silly. ("they learned it all in little league and babe ruth.")

6. Not sure of your point on anything.  Just sounds like you have a gripe with a coach, maybe you didn't get to play or something.
AR
NDPreps Rookie
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 5:37 am

Postby JoJoNino » Sun Mar 18, 2007 6:29 pm

Being i havent seen Hatton-Northwood play in forever, how do you think they will do coming back down to Single-A, they had two outstanding seasons in AA but do you think they can keep the momentum going and make it past the first round of the playoffs?
User avatar
JoJoNino
NDPreps Reserve
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:27 am

Postby Thunder66 » Sat Mar 24, 2007 8:51 am

JoJoNino wrote:Being i havent seen Hatton-Northwood play in forever, how do you think they will do coming back down to Single-A, they had two outstanding seasons in AA but do you think they can keep the momentum going and make it past the first round of the playoffs?

I think they have to worry about making the playoffs first, something they've never done in Class A, the classes of 06 and 07 changed the football attitude there and I think it made a difference not having to play teams they've never beaten like Larimore Park River Langdon Harvey, a lot of the players who will be making an impact this season now have never played these teams and i think it will have a similar effect this year
Thunder66
 

Postby Big Hitter » Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:53 am

B wrote:
bballfan_05 wrote:
B wrote:
comet001 wrote:how can players respect coaches when all the prgram does is lose games

Well you can't be from S-D or you would know better.  (Unless you base your posts on 1 season.)  So therefore you must play football in a very good program.  So where do you play???

Um.... idk what the deal is there, but i know they went 1-7 after having two teams go to the playoffs. Yes, every team loses good players and has to rebuild. However, it also comes down to coaching in many aspects and being to adapt to their players that given year. Often, some coaches try to run the same offense year after year when they don't have the personal to do it. Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year.

"Good coaches can make any group of kids respectible and competitive year after year."


You obviously have ZERO coaching experience!!!

In the smaller schools you will most likely have some years where either injuries can hurt you, or you don't have many kids (like playing 11-man with about 21-23 kids) or you might have a bunch of underclassmen (which is ok in other sports, football is NOT one of them) or you just might have kids that aren't very physical.  This doesn't mean they are "bad" kids but any of these or a combination of these things will be awfully hard on a football teams record.     

Even in recent years (past 6?) Turtle Lake and Edgeley-Kulm have had 2 win seasons.  Personally I think they have good coaches.  I can think of some very good coaches that had great teams 8-15 years ago but because of shrinking enrollments they haven't been able to compete for awhile.  Do I think all of their kids that they have ever coached think "highly" of them?  NO!!  That is not the main point of coaching because you are never going to make everyone happy.

Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
This is one of the most true and best worded post i have read very good!
Big Hitter
 

Postby Big Hitter » Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:58 am

Shocker wrote:[user=87]B[/user] wrote:
Your point on adapting is very true.  You have to run something that works for your personell.  That's a no brainer.  You do "adapt" but you NEVER try to teach something that you dont know or don't believe in.  It's called coaching philosophy.  You have to hang your hat on something.
I don't know if I completely understand what you mean by you "have to hang your hat on something," but if I am interpreting what you are saying correctly, I have to disagree. The New England Patriots don't "hang their hats" on a particular style, they choose a style each week to expliot mismatches. Now, I'm certainly not saying that a North Dakota HS team could have an offense as complex as theirs, but I do think they could run an offense with major changes from week to week. Also, changes would probably be easier on the defensive side of the ball. It could be as easy as switching from a base 4-4, to a base 3-4, or 5-2 against certain teams. If the other team doesn't know what to prepare for, it will be much easier to beat them.

I don't know where your from but you just can't go around changing the way a team plays week to week that isn't always going to work usually you don't have the personal to do it. Plus about New England they play a base 4-3 week in and week out for the past few years. They just throw in different blitzz packages.
Big Hitter
 

Postby TNT » Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:19 am

Velva has no base defense. Velva plays different Defense vs every formation in some games. On offense some teams never change game plan vs different opponents. Velva attacks the weak players on the other team or the holes in the defense. so to say it can not be done in high school is wrong.
TNT
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:47 pm
Location: North Dakota USA

Postby Shocker » Tue Mar 27, 2007 4:12 am

TNT wrote:Velva has no base defense. Velva plays different Defense vs every formation in some games. On offense some teams never change game plan vs different opponents. Velva attacks the weak players on the other team or the holes in the defense. so to say it can not be done in high school is wrong.
Exactly. It seems like you and I are the only ones that realize what they are doing. It's no wonder that nobody has been able to beat them if they don't even realize this is going on.

As for Big Hitter's comment about not having the personnel to do it, I would argue that you have to have better personnel to win consistantly by using the same defense every week than by changing it as needed. I'll say it again, it's a lot easier to prepare when you know exactly what's coming at you.
Shocker
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:21 am

Postby baller01 » Wed Mar 28, 2007 2:52 pm

Who are going to be the top returning offensive and defensive players this year?
Winning isn't everything--but wanting to win is. -Vince Lombardi
User avatar
baller01
NDPreps Hall of Fame
 
Posts: 1542
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:28 pm

Postby Thunder66 » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:44 pm

Jon Nelson was an all state guard as a junior but IMO he's a much better linebacker for Hatton-Northwood

others in Region 2, Karl Hagar from Larimore was an all state running back as a sophomore but will probably move to quarterback now that his brother Sam is gone, Troy Dale from MPCG is a monster at linebacker and FB/TE, he'll be a senior, another guy is Mitch Ford from Cavalier, an all state running back behind a pretty bad offensive line compared to what they're used to
Thunder66
 

PreviousNext

Return to A

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests