North Dakota Preps

Sounds like their is a very good chance the "AA" class will be scratched by the high school activities association in the next three to four years.  When that happens the sixteen teams currently in this division will be dropped down to the "A" level.  I hate to see this happen because there have been some very nice rivalries that have emerged over the years.  I can alse hear the smaller schools scream when teams like Devils Lake, Hazen, Watford City and Beulah move down a class.:X

[user=12]scc[/user] wrote:

This state is not big enough for four football divisions.  A change is needed.

I agree, some class A schools right now could be playing 9-man right now. Should just go back to class A, B and 9-man.

If they take away AA (which I'm sure they will after next year) it will be interesting to see what teams move where.  I can't see DL and VC (and maybe even teams like Buelah and Grafton) staying in Class B fball.  I'm sure a couple teams will get moved back up to A and some of the smaller schools that are 11man now will get moved down to 9man.

Why would those teams want to move to A? I think that all would happen is that a lot of teams would just move down to nineman that would like to play elevenman football. I know right now that Killdeer, Stanley, and Velva's pop puts them at nineman but choose to stay up. Why would you want to play team that are 3X or 4X bigger than you?

So ok...Let me guess this straight. In basketball they wan't more classes and in football they want less classes. This makes a lot of sense*sarcasm* since football is a game of numbers. Look at the teams that are most successful in their divisions. They are usually the teams with the greatest numbers of kids out for football. In some cases and years it would be ok, example Killdeer beating Watford. But that wouldn't happen that often.

In basketball, a team like Beach can atleast compete with a team such as Hazen. In football however, Hazen vs Beach would be a massacre.

mike thingstad wrote:Why would those teams want to move to A? I think that all would happen is that a lot of teams would just move down to nineman that would like to play elevenman football. I know right now that Killdeer, Stanley, and Velva's pop puts them at nineman but choose to stay up. Why would you want to play team that are 3X or 4X bigger than you?

Killdeer, Stanley, and Velva's enrollment does not put them in 9man. 

I think if you dropped 4 teams from A to 9 man, 12 from AA to A, and raised 4 to AAA (whcih would now be AA), you could work something out. 

Velva, Stanley, and Killdeer all had to appy to play A ball this year. Remember that they use how many boys you have in your school not total enrollment. Trinity was nineman until they added a co-op then had to apply up to AA.

mike thingstad wrote:Velva, Stanley, and Killdeer all had to appy to play A ball this year. Remember that they use how many boys you have in your school not total enrollment. Trinity was nineman until they added a co-op then had to apply up to AA.

You need to check your facts.....I know they go by male enrollment in grades 7-10 when deciding the classes for fball.  I have seen these numbers for all schools and the cutoffs for each division.  Velva, Stanley, and Killdeer are all above the cutoff for 9man fball.  The only larger town school that is relatively close is Cavalier, but they were still 5 above the cutoff.  Trinity is nowhere near the 9man numbers.  They added New England as a coop, but that did not add much as far as enrollment numbers.

No I think your right, that was on the three class system that was up for a vote last year. All three were on the 9 man list, but I can't find the numbers any more on ndhsaa

Yeah, that would make sense.  When the state goes back to a 3 class system (which will almost definitely happen after next season) you'll see some of these traditional 11man teams drop down because of declining enrollments and different cutoffs with the classes.

ndlionsfan wrote:Yeah, that would make sense.  When the state goes back to a 3 class system (which will almost definitely happen after next season) you'll see some of these traditional 11man teams drop down because of declining enrollments and different cutoffs with the classes.

How many schools do you think would be close to dropping down?  I think in a perfect world only 4 would drop down but I think more will probably want to if some of those bigger schools are dropped down.

baller01 wrote:So ok...Let me guess this straight. In basketball they wan't more classes and in football they want less classes. This makes a lot of sense*sarcasm* since football is a game of numbers. Look at the teams that are most successful in their divisions. They are usually the teams with the greatest numbers of kids out for football. In some cases and years it would be ok, example Killdeer beating Watford. But that wouldn't happen that often.

In basketball, a team like Beach can atleast compete with a team such as Hazen. In football however, Hazen vs Beach would be a massacre.

Don't get me wrong I don't want 3 classes in bball either, but there are something like 140 bball teams in the state and 100 fball teams.  Based on number of teams, it makes more sense to have more bball divisions than fball.

Stromer wrote:

ndlionsfan wrote:Yeah, that would make sense.  When the state goes back to a 3 class system (which will almost definitely happen after next season) you'll see some of these traditional 11man teams drop down because of declining enrollments and different cutoffs with the classes.

How many schools do you think would be close to dropping down?  I think in a perfect world only 4 would drop down but I think more will probably want to if some of those bigger schools are dropped down.

I think teams like Stanley, Killdeer, New Rockford, Cavalier, Linton, and maybe a couple others will have the option of dropping down or staying 11 man because they will be right around that cutoff line.  Right now there are 50 9man teams with a few coops probably being worked on so in another year there might be 45 teams.  I'm guessing the NDHSAA will want to keep a minimum of 48 teams (6 regions of 8 or 8 regions of 6) for playoff purposes.  Might go higher than that, tho.  Ideally, I'd think 64 9man teams would be best for playoffs and scheduling (8 regions of 8) but I can't see them adding almost 20 teams to the division.

How about this one drop the 4 bottom from AAA to AA drop the 4 bottom from AA to A and leave 9 as is?

That would only leave 12 teams in the largest division....I think that's too small.  I say leave the upper class the same with 16 teams.  Have 32 teams in the middle class (4 regions of 8).  Right now that would make 58 9man teams, up from the current 50 meaning 8 teams would drop from 11 man to 9man.  That way 9man could have 8 regions again with about 7 in a region.  That would also give the teams 2 nonregion games and more people can see how each region stacks up with another.  Given future coops of some of the smaller schools, the 9man would probably remain consistant around 50-55 teams.  If they went with a plan like this there would be less moving around every few years.  The other possibility would be to move DL and VC back up to the top division, make the middle division 32 teams, and drop 6 teams to 9man and still have 8 regions.

My take is to move up 4 teams, probably VC, DL, Beulah, and Grafton up to AAA.  Make 2 divisons in each region of AAA, either by enrollment or geography.  Since there would be 10 teams in each region, everyone would play their region opponents once during the season.  However, playoff berths are determined by division record, which would be 4 games played.  2 berths to each division and then a wild card berth to the 3rd place team that has the best region record.  Thus 10 teams make the playoffs in AAA just like they do now.  Only difference is that DL, Grafton, and others would have a shot at the playoffs.  No chance at a state title but a division crown would still be something to play for.  20 teams total.

Drop the other 12 AA teams down to A and drop the 4 lowest A teams down to 9man.  That would leave us with 4 regions of 8 teams.  Keep the same amount of playoff bids.  Instead of 4 out of 6 in the region making it, it will be 4 out of 8.  Those 4 teams that dropped to 9 man fill out the 4 regions with 8 teams to give us 6 regions with 9.  Keep the playoffs like they are this year (although there is room for another bid per region as well).  If teams co-op, rearrange regions so that each has 8-9 teams per region.

I think it would be good to eliminate AA.  First of all Velva, Harvey, Killdeer and other A schools play a non conference games agianst AA teams.  Velva plays and  beats Minot Ryan.  Harvey plays and wins agaist Rugby.  I dont think the smaller schools would have a prblem competing at all.  It would add a little more varity to the playoffs.  Instead of the same old top four in each class.  I hope it does go back to Class A, B, and nine man. 

yes right now they can but we have classes coming up with only 5 boys in with that in the future what would you do?

Towns like Beulah, Grafton, Valley City and Devils Lake don't stand a chance against the bigger schools.  I just read that Grafton's current HS enrollment is 306.  There is no way Grafton could compete against the likes of Fargo South.

I know it's tough, but if they go to a 3 class system and keep Grafton at the class B ranks they will be going against schools that have a high school enrollment around 100.  It's just as unfair.

Unity77 wrote:Towns like Beulah, Grafton, Valley City and Devils Lake don't stand a chance against the bigger schools.  I just read that Grafton's current HS enrollment is 306.  There is no way Grafton could compete against the likes of Fargo South.

Well I hope things will somewhat even out when Fargo gets a new high school.  While these teams might not have a chance against the bigger schools, you can get that same feeling for some of these schools in other divisions.  If AAA would just add a couple teams and keep playing like they do now, nobody would play from DL, VS, and the like because they have no shot at making the playoffs.  In my plan, by dividing the regions up into divisions, these schools have a decent shot at making the playoffs.  They might get creamed once they get there, but at least they got something.  Is it any better if DL wins AA this year with their only loss being a 3-0 defeat? 

Rumor has it that two teams are thinking of dropping football because they can compete at the level they are at, this might happen to other teams if you put them in a spot where they can't compete. Not win(which is nice to do a time or two) but compete.

Could you share who these two teams are (or at least give us a general idea without actually saying)???

mike thingstad wrote:Rumor has it that two teams are thinking of dropping football because they can compete at the level they are at, this might happen to other teams if you put them in a spot where they can't compete. Not win(which is nice to do a time or two) but compete.

Does anyone know if DL had more kids come out this year because they moved down?  Because this is a fear of moving down teams because they can't compete.  I understand that even though the enrollment puts them in one class, the amount of actual people going out for football is quite lower than projected.  However, when you move them down, it seems to me that people who never played before suddenly join up because they should win more games.  Thus, you really can't give these teams a break.  I won't lose sleep if some teams decide to take the easy way out.