Langdon recruiting

[hgkmjtkitxf]

I tried to be a little sympathetic to the players involved, but this bratz doll whining is getting old.  Your school and your coaches put you in a bind.  Blame them, not us that want high schools to follow the darn rules about recruiting. 

If the HSAA doesn't suspend the school, what should they do?  Make you take vans to the state tourney, or make you drink tap water instead of Dasani?  Seriously, your school screwed up, not the people that post in northdakotapreps.com.  If you want to fight the good fight, go to your school board meetings and get some people reprimanded or fired.  Personally, I think all the coaches and the AD should be fired.  People obviously disagree.  Fine, find some other punishment that is justifiable.  Since you can't qualify for the post season, make them coach for free for a year.  Make the AD administrate without an AD salary.  Force the coaches and the AD to make a public apology to the players, the school, the city, and the HSAA General Assembly. 

But don't fault the HSAA.  They didn't go to Munich and start recruiting players.  Your coaches did that.  They are the reason you're not going to state, not the HSAA.  And in response to an earlier post about this deal never being about state or winning:  If it isn't about going to state, and you can still play a regular season, why are you unhappy?

well i spose on things like this if you state an opinion you're likely to get bashed...so i'll take a turn haha

on the first one, for about the 5 billionth time...they didn't (not that it matters anymore)

and on the second...i posted that response and i don't play for langdon

[fbinnd]

The AD is just as responsible as the coaching staff for any violation of the rules by the coaching staff.  It's the AD's job to impress upon his staff that this type of violation doesn't happen.  If it does, it's then clear that he is not doing his job well enough.  This is an embarrassment to the team, the school, the town, and the HSAA as well. 

And as far as the punishment goes, your own school is to blame.  Instead of protesting the recruiting claims, they should have offered to fire the coaches in exchange for keeping your team eligible.  This represents the second half of whats wrong in our educational system.  Teachers always protect their own, even at the expense of students.  You have a clear violation, and a clear situation where coaches should have resigned or been fired to protect their players.  Instead, the administration backs the teachers 100% even when they are WRONG, and you ladies get screwed.  That's why your principle and superintendant should both be fired as well.

The HSAA should ban these coaches for life, to make sure they never do this again. 

In the long run, your team should still be eligible, I agree with you.  But do you know why you're not?  The HSAA can't fire coaches, they can fire administrators.  All they can do is suspend teams.  Your school gave them no choice.  Grown men and women at Langdon made mistakes and refused to admit them or take responsibility for them.  If those coaches volunteer to resign or if the administration offers to fire them in exchange for keeping you eligible, the HSAA would have left you alone.  But all they could see was their salary, their pension, and their status in the community, and they leveraged it all against your eligibility and won.  You lost.  You don't matter to them.  You're not a player with a soul and one more season to play.  You're a paycheck, a resume' builder, and a stepping stone.  Langdon's volleyball coaches and administrators have no honor, and that's why you'll be sitting this post-season. 

[baller01]

Hey FBINND, funny how Langdon is a public school getting blamed for recruiting when you say all private schools recruit. Obviously the NDHSAA is out there looking for problems such as this and obviously they haven't found any in the private school systems. If this would have been Oak Grove, Shiloh, Minot Ryan, Dickinson Trinity, or any other private school you would be going off the deep end saying how all private schools recruit. So now that we have proof that one public school recruits should we put them all in a hat like you do and say all public schools recruit?

You had one case in the mid 90's where you knew of a player that was recruited to play ball for a private school. However, that matter never got in trouble like this one did. Because of that one case which was never proved as recruiting, you put all the private schools into a hat and said they all recruit. Now we have one confirmed case that a public school recruits. Do I think all public schools recruit? No. Do I think that all private schools recruit? No. Is recruiting out there? Maybe. But it definately isn't black and white between private and public schools. This matter just goes to show that whether you are public or private you still can do stuff wrong.

[fbinnd]

Baller, I addressed this sometime ago in this post.  It took a letter from Cando to get the HSAA to even look into this.  And the penalty was light since Langdon is such a revenue stream for the state volleyball tourney.  The HSAA would probably have looked the other way if this had been a parochial school, and not even done the investigation.

For every Langdon there are 5 Trinity's out there.  And the difference is subtle.  With Langdon, coaches marched right into a home.  This doesn't prove that the parochials are not recruiting, it just proves their better at it than Langdon.  They don't get caught, which is a product of refining the process over many, many years.

And, if you want to get into this again, put your responses in the recruiting thread.  This is about Langdon.  Contrary to what you  think, the world doesn't revolve around Dickinson Trinity or boys basketball.  I'm bored with both, but if need be, we'll roll again.  But we'll roll in the right thread.  If you want to talk about Langdon, do it in the Langdon thread.  If you want to talk about Trinity, Shiloh, Shanley, Oak Grove, or whatever, do it in the recruiting thread.  After all, a thread about recruiting is perfect for all of those parochial schools.

[baseball]

Baller, I addressed this sometime ago in this post.  It took a letter from Cando to get the HSAA to even look into this.  And the penalty was light since Langdon is such a revenue stream for the state volleyball tourney.  The HSAA would probably have looked the other way if this had been a parochial school, and not even done the investigation.

For every Langdon there are 5 Trinity's out there.  And the difference is subtle.  With Langdon, coaches marched right into a home.  This doesn't prove that the parochials are not recruiting, it just proves their better at it than Langdon.  They don't get caught, which is a product of refining the process over many, many years.

And, if you want to get into this again, put your responses in the recruiting thread.  This is about Langdon.  Contrary to what you  think, the world doesn't revolve around Dickinson Trinity or boys basketball.  I'm bored with both, but if need be, we'll roll again.  But we'll roll in the right thread.  If you want to talk about Langdon, do it in the Langdon thread.  If you want to talk about Trinity, Shiloh, Shanley, Oak Grove, or whatever, do it in the recruiting thread.  After all, a thread about recruiting is perfect for all of those parochial schools.

i still havent seen you put any dates, names, schools up to prove recruiting happens in private school....i wonder if its a jealousy thing that the private schools have all of the success at state.  I bet the Packineaus werent even from Parshall and they got recruited.  after all they did win state....they mustve cheated

[BBall dominator]

I can't count on all my fingers how many times public school coaches have called students to come to their school I've been called by a public school coach and I know a few of my teammates were and students at other schools who were called I can't name an instance where our coach called someone(parachioal school coach).  I don't think recruiting should go on. It happens it bothers some people alot some not so much it'll happen it just depends on if they caught but no one makes that big of a deal about it maybe here on a message board and in small town bars and diners but no action ever takes place I'm really suprised that someone stepped to do this I'm impressed

what school did you play for when you were called?

Shiloh

[cdub1]

The AD is just as responsible as the coaching staff for any violation of the rules by the coaching staff.  It's the AD's job to impress upon his staff that this type of violation doesn't happen.  If it does, it's then clear that he is not doing his job well enough.  This is an embarrassment to the team, the school, the town, and the HSAA as well. 

And as far as the punishment goes, your own school is to blame.  Instead of protesting the recruiting claims, they should have offered to fire the coaches in exchange for keeping your team eligible.  This represents the second half of whats wrong in our educational system.  Teachers always protect their own, even at the expense of students.  You have a clear violation, and a clear situation where coaches should have resigned or been fired to protect their players.  Instead, the administration backs the teachers 100% even when they are WRONG, and you ladies get screwed.  That's why your principle and superintendant should both be fired as well.

The HSAA should ban these coaches for life, to make sure they never do this again. 

In the long run, your team should still be eligible, I agree with you.  But do you know why you're not?  The HSAA can't fire coaches, they can fire administrators.  All they can do is suspend teams.  Your school gave them no choice.  Grown men and women at Langdon made mistakes and refused to admit them or take responsibility for them.  If those coaches volunteer to resign or if the administration offers to fire them in exchange for keeping you eligible, the HSAA would have left you alone.  But all they could see was their salary, their pension, and their status in the community, and they leveraged it all against your eligibility and won.  You lost.  You don't matter to them.  You're not a player with a soul and one more season to play.  You're a paycheck, a resume' builder, and a stepping stone.  Langdon's volleyball coaches and administrators have no honor, and that's why you'll be sitting this post-season. 

it is not the fault of the ad wut his/her coaches choose to do he/she isnt a slave driver standing behind them with a whip ready to jump on them the moment they do something wrong

no way should these coaches be fired they made one small mistake if you want to look at it in the big picture i can see if this happened 2 or 3 times but once is a mistake that can be fixed

then you wanna say the principal and superintendant should be fired because they didn't fire the volleyball coaches who are obviously doing a good job since they are going to state every year how about the ndhsaa backs off and tries not to make langdon an example cause it already has pretty much already been said that it needs to happen to mandan and the ndhsaa is just trying to make langdon an example and its dumb

[fbinnd]

So, CDUB1, if a school gets caught recruiting, then they should face.....oh wait, lets see.......coaches not fired, administrators not reprimanded, obviously the team being suspended is not fair..........so, I guess you think the fair punishment for recruiting is:

NOTHING!!

Dude, seriously, we can argue over whether parochials recruit or not, but if you break the rules, you get punished.  What do you think the appropriate punishment would have been.

[cdub1]

So, CDUB1, if a school gets caught recruiting, then they should face.....oh wait, lets see.......coaches not fired, administrators not reprimanded, obviously the team being suspended is not fair..........so, I guess you think the fair punishment for recruiting is:

NOTHING!!

Dude, seriously, we can argue over whether parochials recruit or not, but if you break the rules, you get punished.  What do you think the appropriate punishment would have been.

i think you suspend the coaches for maybe 5 games maybe even the entire season and dont allow the transfers to go through cause the girls on the langdon team are not even the ones who caused this

[fbinnd]

Penalty:  Suspend coaches and deny transfers.

Message:  Try as hard as you can to sneak transfers by, and if you get caught, you'll have to bartend for a season to make up for your coaching money, until you can get it back the next year.  But if you don't get caught, you're home free and back in the state tourney.

Real excellent solution.  How about you go to the store and rip off about $100.00 worth of stuff, and if you get caught, you have to give it back and you can't go to the store for a week?  That's a deterrent.  CDUB, you must have written the current DUI rules in North Dakota.

[baseball]

Penalty:  Suspend coaches and deny transfers.

Message:  Try as hard as you can to sneak transfers by, and if you get caught, you'll have to bartend for a season to make up for your coaching money, until you can get it back the next year.  But if you don't get caught, you're home free and back in the state tourney.

Real excellent solution.  How about you go to the store and rip off about $100.00 worth of stuff, and if you get caught, you have to give it back and you can't go to the store for a week?  That's a deterrent.  CDUB, you must have written the current DUI rules in North Dakota.

kinda like my example of a secretary stealing supplies and the executives get fired in relation to your theory of firing  the AD, principle, and superidentant..........................

[cdub1]

Penalty:  Suspend coaches and deny transfers.

Message:  Try as hard as you can to sneak transfers by, and if you get caught, you'll have to bartend for a season to make up for your coaching money, until you can get it back the next year.  But if you don't get caught, you're home free and back in the state tourney.

Real excellent solution.  How about you go to the store and rip off about $100.00 worth of stuff, and if you get caught, you have to give it back and you can't go to the store for a week?  That's a deterrent.  CDUB, you must have written the current DUI rules in North Dakota.

kinda hard to compare laws with rules and regulations neway as recruiting isnt actually illegal so you shouldnt lose your job for something that isnt illegal and y have a horrible punishment for such a small infraction that happened one time and then you are punishin the wrong people neway

think about this if you steal $100 of stuff your friends with you dont all lose $100 too and get kicked out of the store

[fbinnd]

Yaaahhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!  More ebonics from CDUB!!!!  Let me see if I can respond in a language you understand:

Com on, dawwwwg, you be trippin, yo!!  Dat shiznit 'bout 'cruitin not bein' e-legal is redic, dawwwwg.  Yo, yo, yo, says rite dere is dem bylawwws dat no schoo be steppin' up in my hood an takin' my homies oveh to da eas side.  Dem dat be kickin' in the wes side crib sposuh be stayin' up in her.

Yo, yo, eny dawwwg dat be comin' up in my haus and thievin' my homies be breakin' dem rules.  An dey gotta do da time, meeeaaaann!  Dat stuff 'bout 'cruitin not bein' bad jus craze tawwk, yo!  Dem coaches shuda stepped owff dem Munich girlz' backside an stayin' in the Langdon hood, G.

[cdub1]

Yaaahhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!  More ebonics from CDUB!!!!  Let me see if I can respond in a language you understand:

Com on, dawwwwg, you be trippin, yo!!  Dat shiznit 'bout 'cruitin not bein' e-legal is redic, dawwwwg.  Yo, yo, yo, says rite dere is dem bylawwws dat no schoo be steppin' up in my hood an takin' my homies oveh to da eas side.  Dem dat be kickin' in the wes side crib sposuh be stayin' up in her.

Yo, yo, eny dawwwg dat be comin' up in my haus and thievin' my homies be breakin' dem rules.  An dey gotta do da time, meeeaaaann!  Dat stuff 'bout 'cruitin not bein' bad jus craze tawwk, yo!  Dem coaches shuda stepped owff dem Munich girlz' backside an stayin' in the Langdon hood, G.

k honestly u tryna get me mad aint gonna work really my last post i wuz speakin great not hard to read at all

recruiting isnt against a law as in you coudln't go to jail for it i guess i could have explained that so you would understand

i have never heard nebody talk like u iz rite now and its annoyin and dont need to be on hurr i u wanna try to talk like dat at least no how to talk

[fbinnd]

CDUB, you win.......on the ebonics.  I can't match that.

Recruiting might not be against the North Dakota Century Code (which is the collection of laws the state has), but it is a violation of the bylaws of the NDHSAA, so you are wrong in stating that recruiting isn't against the law.  If you want to be a member of the NDHSAA, you accept that you will follow their laws.  Langdon broke them.

[cdub1]

CDUB, you win.......on the ebonics.  I can't match that.

Recruiting might not be against the North Dakota Century Code (which is the collection of laws the state has), but it is a violation of the bylaws of the NDHSAA, so you are wrong in stating that recruiting isn't against the law.  If you want to be a member of the NDHSAA, you accept that you will follow their laws.  Langdon broke them.

i wont argue that langdon broke rules that is a fact the punishment did not fit the crime as players on the Langdom team can't play when it was players from the Cando (i think) team who started this mess

and im right it isn't against north dakota state law to recruit as no legal action can be taken against you can't be put in jail for example

what exactly are you trying to argue with me that langdon broke the rules i agree with that are you going to try to tell me that you should pretty much fire every employee of the school over volleyball?

[NDSportsFan]

Please contain all further comments to the topic at hand, or we will just delete the entire post.  There is no need to be calling anyone brats, or making fun of anyone else, please hold yourself to a higher standard than that.

Have a great day!

[fbinnd]

First, NDSportsfan, I appreciate the latitude.  I'll refrain from further language lessons.

CDUB, this is a simple point:  It's about accountability.  The rules were broken, and someone has to be held accountable.  People get fired over accountability all the time, and no laws are broken.  They get fired because they don't do their job right or at all.  Not showing up for work isn't a crime, but you get fired for it.  You don't have to break the law to get fired.

Langdon's coaches learn little if they are not fired.  Neither does the school.  It's clear the school doesn't think they did anything wrong.  That's why the school allowed this punishment to occur.  There is no doubt in my mind that if coaches got fired over this, those players in Langdon would now be eligible.  All the school had to do is admit wrong-doing and hold someone accountable, and this situation would be over and done with.  Instead, there are broken hearts all over that volleyball team because the school and the coaches have no honor and can't do the right thing.

CDUB, you made it clear in the "recruiting" thread that you started that you believe in the student's right to the bigger, better deal, without regard for the rules.  That is what separates you from fairness in athletics.  High schools, the NCAA, even the NBA and NFL have rules to follow (recruiting laws, scholarship limits, salary caps, etc.).  Look at how hard the T-Wolves got slapped on the Joe Smith contract.  Sure, Kevin McHale only had to sit out a year, but the team lost picks for years, and it affects them to this day.  In this deal, the only people punished are Langdon's seniors.  I agree with the suspension.  The loss of a post-season is painful, and should send some kind of example.  But those players were robbed of a last opportunity, or a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, if they are finally playing alot.  How do you put a price on that?  Any coach or administrator that robs a player of a year of eligibility should be fired without hesitation.

[cdub1]

First, NDSportsfan, I appreciate the latitude.  I'll refrain from further language lessons.

CDUB, this is a simple point:  It's about accountability.  The rules were broken, and someone has to be held accountable.  People get fired over accountability all the time, and no laws are broken.  They get fired because they don't do their job right or at all.  Not showing up for work isn't a crime, but you get fired for it.  You don't have to break the law to get fired.

Langdon's coaches learn little if they are not fired.  Neither does the school.  It's clear the school doesn't think they did anything wrong.  That's why the school allowed this punishment to occur.  There is no doubt in my mind that if coaches got fired over this, those players in Langdon would now be eligible.  All the school had to do is admit wrong-doing and hold someone accountable, and this situation would be over and done with.  Instead, there are broken hearts all over that volleyball team because the school and the coaches have no honor and can't do the right thing.

CDUB, you made it clear in the "recruiting" thread that you started that you believe in the student's right to the bigger, better deal, without regard for the rules.  That is what separates you from fairness in athletics.  High schools, the NCAA, even the NBA and NFL have rules to follow (recruiting laws, scholarship limits, salary caps, etc.).  Look at how hard the T-Wolves got slapped on the Joe Smith contract.  Sure, Kevin McHale only had to sit out a year, but the team lost picks for years, and it affects them to this day.  In this deal, the only people punished are Langdon's seniors.  I agree with the suspension.  The loss of a post-season is painful, and should send some kind of example.  But those players were robbed of a last opportunity, or a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, if they are finally playing alot.  How do you put a price on that?  Any coach or administrator that robs a player of a year of eligibility should be fired without hesitation.

the langdon coaches are doing their jobs great i hear its state 9 years in a row

what do they learn if they are fired then...they don't have a job so its not like they have a chance to do it right

i think it is the right of the student athlete to get as much out of athletics as they can

the only administrators robbing the girls of their senior years are the ndhsaa it is their fault that they chose to not allow a postseason there are punishments that aren't getting rid of a postseason and aren't firing the coach for example

lower pay or no pay

coach's suspended for 1 season something like that

instead they decide to screw the girls over not really fair is it?

[baseball]

CDUB, you win.......on the ebonics.  I can't match that.

Recruiting might not be against the North Dakota Century Code (which is the collection of laws the state has), but it is a violation of the bylaws of the NDHSAA, so you are wrong in stating that recruiting isn't against the law.  If you want to be a member of the NDHSAA, you accept that you will follow their laws.  Langdon broke them.

yes....question for ya though fbinnd.  what does the first "A" in NDHSAA stand for?  i thought it was "activities"???  what does a principle and superindentant have to do with the "activities".  I suppose if Munich has a stud at speech and Langdon calls them up the Math teacher should be fired along with the English/Speech teacher???

[baller01]

Baller, I addressed this sometime ago in this post.  It took a letter from Cando to get the HSAA to even look into this.  And the penalty was light since Langdon is such a revenue stream for the state volleyball tourney.  The HSAA would probably have looked the other way if this had been a parochial school, and not even done the investigation.

For every Langdon there are 5 Trinity's out there.  And the difference is subtle.  With Langdon, coaches marched right into a home.  This doesn't prove that the parochials are not recruiting, it just proves their better at it than Langdon.  They don't get caught, which is a product of refining the process over many, many years.

And, if you want to get into this again, put your responses in the recruiting thread.  This is about Langdon.  Contrary to what you  think, the world doesn't revolve around Dickinson Trinity or boys basketball.  I'm bored with both, but if need be, we'll roll again.  But we'll roll in the right thread.  If you want to talk about Langdon, do it in the Langdon thread.  If you want to talk about Trinity, Shiloh, Shanley, Oak Grove, or whatever, do it in the recruiting thread.  After all, a thread about recruiting is perfect for all of those parochial schools.

Four words for you FBIIND...

"[font=verdana]Innocent until proven guilty"[/font]

[fbinnd]

There are two words that keep you "innocent".  They are:  Plausible Deniability.

[baller01]

There are two words that keep you "innocent".  They are:  Plausible Deniability.

Obviously didn't work for Langdon...

[fbinnd]

Like I said, the parochials are better at it.  Coaches meet with families=recruiting violations.  Families do the recruiting with the direction of the coach completely off the record="We don't recruit!!  We just have good kids and good programs!!"

Plausible Deniability.

[baseball]

Like I said, the parochials are better at it.  Coaches meet with families=recruiting violations.  Families do the recruiting with the direction of the coach completely off the record="We don't recruit!!  We just have good kids and good programs!!"

Plausible Deniability.

ill ask again....what is your evidence instead of jealousy to their success