Langdon recruiting

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Postby fbinnd » Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:28 am

Kids from Dilworth transferring to parochials.  Kids from Mandan and Bismarck publics transferring to parochials.  Kids from Velva, Stanley, and Minot High transferring to parochials. 

Sorry, if you want me to rat out a bunch of people, it's not gonna happen.  It isn't their fault they get sent to Parochial X by their parents after from arm-twisting.  But it happens, we all know it, and you can run and hide behind your shield of "proof" all you want.  If the NDHSAA snooped around the parochials as much as they snooped around Langdon, we'd be down 10 more programs this year, next year, and every year.
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Postby fbinnd » Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:12 am

Sure, a few.
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Postby baller01 » Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:46 am

Then do it. Go for it. See if you can get all the private schools taken out of class B. Then maybe we won't have to go to 3 classes. I personally will be upset because the private schools provide good competition year in and year out. I'd rather lose to a good team, private or not, then domiante a bunch of bad teams.

FBINND since you are so convinced about there recruiting, and if you think it is such a corrupt problem, take it to the NDHSAA.

Even if you put in your two words, "Plausible Deniability",  but you are still the four words I said, "Innoncent until proven guilty", no matter how much you deny.
Winning isn't everything--but wanting to win is. -Vince Lombardi
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Postby vballer5 » Wed Jun 27, 2007 5:47 pm

baseball wrote:
vballer5 wrote:
baseball wrote:
vballer5 wrote:
baseball wrote:you still have yet to provide proof of all these parochials recruiting?  what evidance do you have.........repeat state appearances, o wow.  bring out the big guns and take sports away from that school so others have a chance.  the proof in this case was that the coach did indeed go into the homes of students.  if he didnt you would still accuse Langdon of recruiting because the 9 straight state seasons.

The only problem i do see with the punishment is that the coach does still have a job.  im not suggesting taking coaching away for the rest of his life but a 2-3 year suspension maybe.  other then that i agree with the punishment 100%.  why do you feel teachers and the school board should be fired?  unless the caoch was a teacher maybe he can be fired but i still dont think that would be right.  you cant take away from the kids education because a coach messed up.  after all, the kids are referred to as "STUDENT athletes".  unless they were in the house with the coach talking to the kids, why do they deserve to lose their job???

go back to a real world scenario again.  say a secretary or whatever is stealing supplies and money from an office.  do you fire the president, VP, CEO, COO and all them high rollers just because some intern took a few staplers??

excellent!!!! you are catching on!

haha i wouldnt say we agree yet.  i still like the punishment, just not his idiots idea to fire the whole school.....i suppose the custodians can stay

suppose so... i agree with punishment at a different level towards different people so we have something in common.

yea we both disagree with fbinnd haha

thats a for sure!
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Postby ND_Coach » Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:56 pm

To the Langdon Volleyball players:

I see that most of you are not posting anymore but I hope you still check back in now and then.

You have been put in a bad position.  Your coach made a mistake when he met those girls from Munich.  I know that Munich was looking to Co-op with Langdon, and for excellent reasons in my opinion, regardless he met with players that were technically part of another program and discussed Langdon volleyball.  This is recruiting and is a violation of NDHSAA rules.  I do feel the punishment of a post season ban for one year is fair.

It is unfortunate for the seniors that will be involved with the Langdon team will not have a chance at the postseason.  However, the NDHSAA is not denying you your senior year, you still get to have your whole regular season.  Also be glad that you have experienced a state tournament, the vast majority of volleyball players in the state never get that chance.  It probally is not fair that the program suffers because of the mistake of the coach, but the program is a reflection of the coach and as it lives and dies with the coaches decision's on the floor, it also lives and dies with his decisions off the floor as well. 

Your team is now at a crossroad.  One path you may take is to continue to protest the fairness and validitity of the NDHSAA's decison, perhaps pack it in, go through the motions and waste the season.  Or, you can accept the fact that there will be no post season and play each regular season game with the utmost of intensity.  I truley hope you go undefeated so you can argue that you were the best team in the state, and at least in your eyes the eventual champion will have an asterik by their name because Langdon wasn't in the tournament.

To the seniors, losing the post season will sting for a year or so, but after that you will move on to bigger and better things.  I know because an injury caused me to miss my senior year of football.  It sucked not being able to play at all, you gals at least get the opportunity to compete, but after a decade out of high school I do not even miss that last year.  You will find in time that more important things will fill your life. 

I wish you all the best of luck in volleyball and whatever other extracurricular activities you pursue.  Keep your head up and work hard.
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Postby fbinnd » Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:53 pm

To ND Coach,

I understand your effort, and I appreciate your candor in labelling this decision as a mistake on the part of the coach involved.  Good for you in parting with the "Iron Curtain" of coaches in this state and calling a spade a spade.

I would like to suggest, however, that telling the players to simply struggle up the injustice and deal with it is not the right advice.

To the Langdon volleyball players:  Demand some accountability in this situation.  I've never been a fan of firing coaches on a win/loss basis.  But at least a coach can sit back and run a clean program.  Your's didn't, and that coach needs to be held accountable. 

ND Coach is right:  The sting of losing this year's potential will eventually fade.  But you have an important choice now.  You can either just go ahead and decide that there's nothing left to fight for, or you can demand that educators and coaches be held accountable for their actions, something that rarely happens in North Dakota.

You volleyball players from Langdon should be attending school board meetings and demanding the firing of this coach.  Simply playing out the season for the season is not enough.  The NDHSAA has pinned the entire punishment on you, and that simply isn't fair.  The school board and administration has allowed the punishment to be pinned solely on you.  The coach has allowed it to happen.  No one will stand up and admit responsibility.  They are all cowards to allow 17 and 18 year old girls to do the time they should have to do. 

If your coach survives with a job, and your administrators and school board sit back and let you take all the punishment, it will be an injustice that will never go away.  You will think about it forever.  You have a chance to make sure that no other player loses a post-season by proving to the state that there really are penalties for not playing by the rules.  It's either that, or someday, when you're in your 20's or 30's, and you hear about another team sitting out because their coach recruited, you'll feel like you could have prevented it, and didn't.  Don't let the state make you the example.  Make the people responsible live up to it. 
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Postby Baller » Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:01 pm

fbinnd wrote:To ND Coach,

I understand your effort, and I appreciate your candor in labelling this decision as a mistake on the part of the coach involved.  Good for you in parting with the "Iron Curtain" of coaches in this state and calling a spade a spade.

I would like to suggest, however, that telling the players to simply struggle up the injustice and deal with it is not the right advice.

To the Langdon volleyball players:  Demand some accountability in this situation.  I've never been a fan of firing coaches on a win/loss basis.  But at least a coach can sit back and run a clean program.  Your's didn't, and that coach needs to be held accountable. 

ND Coach is right:  The sting of losing this year's potential will eventually fade.  But you have an important choice now.  You can either just go ahead and decide that there's nothing left to fight for, or you can demand that educators and coaches be held accountable for their actions, something that rarely happens in North Dakota.

You volleyball players from Langdon should be attending school board meetings and demanding the firing of this coach.  Simply playing out the season for the season is not enough.  The NDHSAA has pinned the entire punishment on you, and that simply isn't fair.  The school board and administration has allowed the punishment to be pinned solely on you.  The coach has allowed it to happen.  No one will stand up and admit responsibility.  They are all cowards to allow 17 and 18 year old girls to do the time they should have to do. 

If your coach survives with a job, and your administrators and school board sit back and let you take all the punishment, it will be an injustice that will never go away.  You will think about it forever.  You have a chance to make sure that no other player loses a post-season by proving to the state that there really are penalties for not playing by the rules.  It's either that, or someday, when you're in your 20's or 30's, and you hear about another team sitting out because their coach recruited, you'll feel like you could have prevented it, and didn't.  Don't let the state make you the example.  Make the people responsible live up to it. 


ND_Coach...Your post was great and well thought out.  I think that these players can take some things from it and maybe find some solace.

FBinnd...do you ever have anything nice to say?  DO you go through life hating everything and being pessimistic like you do on this board?  If so, you are that guy in the office that no one wants to talk to because all he wants to do it complain and find something to fight about.  That cannot be a happy life.
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Postby bisonman » Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:50 am

I'm taking it, there will be no tenth straight title? Good run.
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Postby fbinnd » Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:50 am

Baller, I have a perfectly happy life and a great working relationship with my co-employees.  So lay off the personal crap.  The fact that we're all just supposed to look the other way and not hold people accountable for their actions is truly a mirror image of the current school system in North Dakota.  The schools are always right, the students are always wrong, and teachers and administrators never have to answer to anyone. 

It's rediculous, and this situation is a perfect opportunity for people to tell the schools to get off their high horses and come back to Earth.  But no, that won't happen.  Instead, we'll all just stick our heads in the sand and let the girls take the fall.  That shows real courage.
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Postby ndfan » Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:07 pm

PREP VOLLEYBALL: A difficult situation
By Greg DeVillers, Herald Staff Writer
Published Tuesday, July 17, 2007


Langdon High School, which is in the process of appealing a ruling that will suspend its volleyball team from the postseason in 2007, has decided to not renew contracts to two of its coaches.
Head volleyball coach Rich Olson and assistant coach Tami Flink will not be offered their coaching contracts by the Langdon School Board for the 2007 season. The decision was made at the board's meeting earlier this month.

“We're looking at the penalty imposed by the North Dakota High School Activities Association and trying to figure out a way that we can get it reversed,â€
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Postby Stromer » Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:55 am

Well the appeal is to be heard today.  Will the actions of not hiring back the coaches be enough to save their postseason?
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Postby Stromer » Mon Jul 23, 2007 11:02 am

Never mind I just got my answer.  http://www.grandforksherald.com/articles/index.cfm?id=44787&section=News


I think this should make the kids happy but did it accomplish anything in the long run?  If any school gets caught recruiting, just fire the coach and life will go on.  However, if you don't get caught, then you are in the clear.  Doesn't seem like the message I would be sending. 

The interesting part is that the Cando-Munich co-op is not dissolved.  That means for these players that were recruited to play, they will have to move if they want to play.  Very intertesting.
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Postby fbinnd » Mon Jul 23, 2007 11:54 am

First, hats off to the HSAA for not dissolving the co-op.  Half the problem with B sports is that the co-ops are poorly thought out and serve no purpose other than wins and losses.  If a B team has a few good players, and this other B team has a few, let's get together and play.......until our run is over.  Then, we're splitting for the BBD baby (bigger, better deal).  All athletic co-ops should be for a 8 year minimum, with no getting out, period.

Second, hats off to the Langdon school board for holding some coaches accountable.  But, they are only held accountable if they never coach there again.  One year and back is not enough.  If they are hired back after a year, it shows that Langdon is simply treating the recruiting problem cosmetically, and not dealing with the issue of recruiting.

Third, hats off to the HSAA for seeing the light, and not punishing the players.  Now, can the HSAA learn from itself and see that some situations need special circumstances, and not just try to bunch everyone into a convenient set of rules.  Example:  Why is it bad if the EDC has less teams than the WDA?  Why did the HSAA make Jamestown move to the west just to even it out?  DUH!!!!

Finally, coach Olson needs to get his head examined.  He shouldn't be fired for this?  It's his job to be smarter than the parents that request a face-to-face meeting about breaking a co-op.  This isn't rocket science.  You don't recruit players, and if it smells like recruiting, you don't do it, and error on the side of caution.  He put his entire team's season in jeopardy.  He should be fired from coaching and teaching, his house should be sold, his bags packed for him, and he should be escorted by the Langdon police to the state line, any state line, and told not to come back, ever.  He dirtied up the laundry of high school athletics in North Dakota.  Granted, the parochials already dirty it up enough, but he brought more filth to the load.  This is not behavior that should be rewarded.
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Postby rep » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:33 pm

ummm...so yeah...langdon has been reinstated for postseason play
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Postby rep » Mon Jul 23, 2007 7:21 pm

apparently the coach is out for a year and then the school has the option to resign him as coach. the team can compete in the postseason. munich is not allowed to co-op with langdon. langdon is under a two-year probation - no idea what the terms of the probation are, just that they are under probation.

all in all, i just want the ndhsaa to make a decision and stick with it. be it deciding classes or regions or punishments. quit the flip-flopping and just pick something and stick with it.
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Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:42 am

word has it from a couple of langdon parents i know that the two coaches will be re-employed after "sitting" one year; a couple of parents will coach and hold their spot and receive any "help" they need......yep, this decision by the ndhsaa really taught the school/kids somethig all right. geez, louise, for once have the guts to stand your ground.
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Postby MLCFB » Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:08 am

Fbinnd, I am in agreement with you.  The Langdon program is to be punished.  High school sports are suppose to be the purest form of sports.  College sports does not have that innocence anymore with all of the boosters and illegal recruiting.

Steroids, dog fighting, cheating refs, and high school recruiting in NORTH DAKOTA. 

Unbelievable.   
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Postby Run With It » Thu Jul 26, 2007 11:29 am

well this is the dumbest thing i have ever heard....
yah lets just 1/2 ways punish a coach for doin something illegal and let them run around and try to act all innocent...
oh while we are at it lets not even teach anyone else a lesson on recruiting..
give langdon the opportunity to hire the coach back..yah REAL smart...so anyone else who wants to try this and gets caught will just be like "oh well langdon only got the coach fired for a year...that aint so bad!"
and then have the players wine about it! for gosh sakes!...any highschool athlete should realise what recruiting is and know that no matter what a coach cant come into your house for a private meeting..thats pretty much common sense to ANY athlete..
NDHSAA just needs set rules in stone and notice that what they decided for punishment teaches NO ONE a lesson at all.
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Postby fbinnd » Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:16 pm

Exactly.  No lesson here at all.  It's obvious that the NDHSAA just simply doesn't consider recruiting a problem.  Even when they know it went on, they turn a blind eye, and establish a punishment because they absolutely have to, not because they want to end recruiting.

These coaches should be out of the game indefinitely.  I'm sure that if the NDHSAA tried to permanently ban these coaches, the North Dakota Education Association would sue, which is probably what the HSAA is scared of in the first place.  After all, in North Dakota, teachers can do no wrong, and can't be punished even when they do, because th NDEA is a more powerful union than any other.  Teachers and coaches will forever be protected by this rogue organization.  Too bad, too, since so many of them think they are so unbelievably important.
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Postby BBall dominator » Fri Jul 27, 2007 11:14 pm

fbinnd wrote:Exactly.  No lesson here at all.  It's obvious that the NDHSAA just simply doesn't consider recruiting a problem.  Even when they know it went on, they turn a blind eye, and establish a punishment because they absolutely have to, not because they want to end recruiting.

These coaches should be out of the game indefinitely.  I'm sure that if the NDHSAA tried to permanently ban these coaches, the North Dakota Education Association would sue, which is probably what the HSAA is scared of in the first place.  After all, in North Dakota, teachers can do no wrong, and can't be punished even when they do, because th NDEA is a more powerful union than any other.  Teachers and coaches will forever be protected by this rogue organization.  Too bad, too, since so many of them think they are so unbelievably important.

oh wow is just me or is fbinnd the smartest guy ever?? he knows all the answers to fixiing up high school sports and hes not even the least bit worried about it because hes so smart and he doesn't care about it but yet hes on here every day figuring out a way to talk about it... wow fbinnd I wish when I get married and have a real job I can be just like you and worry about how the private schools and public schools are ruining HS sports... your are a real man
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Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:36 pm

do you really have to be such a jerk? please offer an opinion on the subject not on fbinnd personally; langdon recruited, it was admitted by them and the girls, now they got off with a slap on the wrist and wink.  anyone who doesn't believe they'll do it again is loco......they'll just do a better job of hiding it next time.
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Postby baseball11 » Sat Jul 28, 2007 8:16 pm

I guess I don't see a problem with the person being involved in the recruiting being punished instead of innocent bystanders.  The coaches may have gotten off easy, but at least they're punishing the right person.
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Postby cdub1 » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:01 pm

luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:do you really have to be such a jerk? please offer an opinion on the subject not on fbinnd personally; langdon recruited, it was admitted by them and the girls, now they got off with a slap on the wrist and wink.  anyone who doesn't believe they'll do it again is loco......they'll just do a better job of hiding it next time.

i don't think they will do it again because they know they got off easy too and they know the ndhsaa won't be so nice if they catch them again
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Postby fbinnd » Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:01 am

Awesome!  So our schools can feel free to do anything they want, as long as they only do it once.  Or who knows, maybe it's once in 5 years and then you can do it again.

There was no lesson here at all, except for a few thousand bucks the coaches will lose, which will probably be funneled to them by the "fill-ins" that will be meeting with them nightly to see what the gameplan should be.  I wonder who from Langdon will be policing the gym on practice days to make sure the coaches aren't there "watching". 

This is pathetic.
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Postby baseball » Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:19 am

fbinnd wrote:Awesome!  So our schools can feel free to do anything they want, as long as they only do it once.  Or who knows, maybe it's once in 5 years and then you can do it again.

There was no lesson here at all, except for a few thousand bucks the coaches will lose, which will probably be funneled to them by the "fill-ins" that will be meeting with them nightly to see what the gameplan should be.  I wonder who from Langdon will be policing the gym on practice days to make sure the coaches aren't there "watching". 

This is pathetic.

what pathetic is you thinking they will do everything to break the rules.  yea i wouldnt be suprised if the school set up a camera system in teh gym so that the old coaches can watch from their living rooms and the current coaches will have lil ear pieces to listen to the other coaches tgo tell them who should be where.....wow....get over it.  il give adult the benefit of the doubt that they wont be hiding under the stage or bleachers or sitting in the rafters to watch the team practice....
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