Langdon recruiting

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Postby NDSportsFan » Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:25 am

My personnal opinion is that the NDHSAA did the right thing.  I'd rather spend my time protesting real problems like the rural meth epidemic, or escalating health care costs for the elderly, or even Michael Vicks dogfighting allegations. 

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Postby wolakota » Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:31 pm

I have been following this thread for quite some time, and having some close ties to those involved, just wanted to say a few words. I also feel like the NDHSAA came to the right answer in the end. The players should not be punished. The coaches realize what they've done wrong and realize that putting the players first is the right thing to do. The Langdon community knows what sort of trouble they landed themselves in and I am positive that they have no intention of repeating the acts. I also believe that it was never the intention of the coaches to steal the Munich players and convince them to come play for Langdon, but to simply present them with the facts of something they had already shown interest in. Obviously the way it was done was illegal and there should be some sort of punishment for the coaches doing something they should have known was wrong. But the intent was not malicious and therefore I do not think that they are getting off easy. Langdon is still going to have a tough year in front of them with the coaching changes and general controversy surrounding the program. If any of the players are reading this I'd like to wish them the best of luck this season.
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Postby cdub1 » Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:26 pm

fbinnd wrote:Awesome!  So our schools can feel free to do anything they want, as long as they only do it once.  Or who knows, maybe it's once in 5 years and then you can do it again.

There was no lesson here at all, except for a few thousand bucks the coaches will lose, which will probably be funneled to them by the "fill-ins" that will be meeting with them nightly to see what the gameplan should be.  I wonder who from Langdon will be policing the gym on practice days to make sure the coaches aren't there "watching". 

This is pathetic.


here is what it looks like to me

they showed all the schools what would happen if you get caught recruiting by langdon's original punishment so the other teams know what will happen

langdon got off because it was the first team caught but i don't think any other teams will get the benefit of "we didn't know it was recruiting" like langdon did
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Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:04 am

cdub1 wrote:
fbinnd wrote:Awesome!  So our schools can feel free to do anything they want, as long as they only do it once.  Or who knows, maybe it's once in 5 years and then you can do it again.

There was no lesson here at all, except for a few thousand bucks the coaches will lose, which will probably be funneled to them by the "fill-ins" that will be meeting with them nightly to see what the gameplan should be.  I wonder who from Langdon will be policing the gym on practice days to make sure the coaches aren't there "watching". 

This is pathetic.


here is what it looks like to me

they showed all the schools what would happen if you get caught recruiting by langdon's original punishment so the other teams know what will happen

langdon got off because it was the first team caught but i don't think any other teams will get the benefit of "we didn't know it was recruiting" like langdon did


sorry but i just don't agree.....what punishment? you've set a precedent by allowing this.......there's no way you can punish anyone else, you let langdon off the hook....you'll have to do the same with everyone else.....coach gone for one season, aug 13 to nov 18, big whoop.  he'll be back next year with what lesson learned? to hide it better?  if the coaches were reasonable and responsible, there's no excuse.  this is his profession, to not know the rules, puleeze. 

and for those who love to compare high school sports to college sports, if there's violations in college, the program is punished, which includes the athletes as well as the coaches

i know coach olson apologized to the coaches association at their meeting but he has to know that most folks are going to be really skeptical (sp?) about that.....he might mean it or he's just doing damage control make himself look better.
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Postby Baller » Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:30 am

luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:
cdub1 wrote:
fbinnd wrote:Awesome!  So our schools can feel free to do anything they want, as long as they only do it once.  Or who knows, maybe it's once in 5 years and then you can do it again.

There was no lesson here at all, except for a few thousand bucks the coaches will lose, which will probably be funneled to them by the "fill-ins" that will be meeting with them nightly to see what the gameplan should be.  I wonder who from Langdon will be policing the gym on practice days to make sure the coaches aren't there "watching". 

This is pathetic.


here is what it looks like to me

they showed all the schools what would happen if you get caught recruiting by langdon's original punishment so the other teams know what will happen

langdon got off because it was the first team caught but i don't think any other teams will get the benefit of "we didn't know it was recruiting" like langdon did


sorry but i just don't agree.....what punishment? you've set a precedent by allowing this.......there's no way you can punish anyone else, you let langdon off the hook....you'll have to do the same with everyone else.....coach gone for one season, aug 13 to nov 18, big whoop.  he'll be back next year with what lesson learned? to hide it better?  if the coaches were reasonable and responsible, there's no excuse.  this is his profession, to not know the rules, puleeze. 

and for those who love to compare high school sports to college sports, if there's violations in college, the program is punished, which includes the athletes as well as the coaches

i know coach olson apologized to the coaches association at their meeting but he has to know that most folks are going to be really skeptical (sp?) about that.....he might mean it or he's just doing damage control make himself look better.

Difference being is that players choose which college to go to and if a program is on probation for a major rules violation, players can choose to go somewhere else and the ones there can transfer...college is a completely different scenario in regards to punishing players.
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Postby baseball » Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:05 am

thats true,  if a recruit is found out to be recruited illegally...or the coach ups and leaves before his career is down....he can transfer to any school without having to sit out a year.
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Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:11 pm

lots of posts on this site refer to college situations when arguing a high school point; but langdon bears some responsibility for the mess, they should have a punishment, nothing happened; probation, oh my gosh, how awful; the munich side of this got off completely free.....whoopee doo, the coop didn't get approved.......the ndhsaa showed no backbone, period.
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Postby Stromer » Mon Jul 30, 2007 6:47 pm

luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:lots of posts on this site refer to college situations when arguing a high school point; but langdon bears some responsibility for the mess, they should have a punishment, nothing happened; probation, oh my gosh, how awful; the munich side of this got off completely free.....whoopee doo, the coop didn't get approved.......the ndhsaa showed no backbone, period.

Actually that is a fitting punishment.  If the Munich girls want to play, they need to play in Cando or move to Langdon.  After burning that bridge earlier this spring, will Cando be jumping to take them back?  Maybe, just for the talent but it will be interesting. 
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Postby fbinnd » Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:34 am

There is no "taking them back".  Munich was not allowed to dissolve their co-op with Northstar.  They're in.  They were never out.  Those girls will be allowed to play for Northstar.  All they did was hang the bait out there.  It's up to Langdon not to bite, and Olson bit and bit hard, to the tune of landing in a living room at a meeting.

Again, if the coaches had to endure some kind of real punishment, I could understand.  But they don't.  Their jobs are being held securly in the hands of the temps until next year.  Langdon is eligible for the postseason.  Come fall 2008, it will be like none of this ever happened.  We'd like to thank the NDHSAA for sweeping yet another controversial item under the rug. 
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Postby MLCFB » Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:01 am

It is a "feel-good society" now.

"Oh you girls feel sad, well lets just change our minds and forget about the punishment."

The program should have been punished.  The coach represented the school when he went into that house and the school should of got punished as well.  But nope, the v-ball team said it wasn't fair.  Well life is not fair.   
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Postby ndfbfan » Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:17 am

I think this has opened a possible can of worms for ND high school athletics. Let me give you a scenario. This is totally hypothetical but similiar to what happened with Langdon. I'll use Killdeer as my example because its my old high school. The coach from Killdeer decides to go and talk to a few kids from Dickinson who are interested in playing somewhere other than DHS or THS. He visits with 3 sophomores who are really decent players and 1 freshman kid who is a stud. The NDHSAA finds out about the incident, the coach is suspended for one year, the kids decide to open enroll at Killdeer and are able to play their junior and senior years with the head coach coming back. They win 2 state titles all while the coach was suspended for one year, and the kids were still able to come to Killdeer. Is this far fetched? Maybe, but after what the NDHSAA did, it is plausible.
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Postby fbinnd » Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:13 am

Exactly my point:  If there are no long-term consequences, there is no reason to not actively recruit.  If the kids lose a year, they have to live with that forever.  If they have a multi-year or lifetime suspension, that's a part of their career they can't get back.  But one year means exactly what you spelled out, recruit the heck out of the freshman and sophomores and if you get caught for a year, oh well, look what you've built for yourself.

It's open season in North Dakota for recuiting.  Again, thank you NDHSAA for preserving the integrity of the high school game.  You might as well call it the University of Langdon.
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Postby Stromer » Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:46 am

fbinnd wrote:There is no "taking them back".  Munich was not allowed to dissolve their co-op with Northstar.  They're in.  They were never out.  Those girls will be allowed to play for Northstar.  All they did was hang the bait out there.  It's up to Langdon not to bite, and Olson bit and bit hard, to the tune of landing in a living room at a meeting.

Again, if the coaches had to endure some kind of real punishment, I could understand.  But they don't.  Their jobs are being held securly in the hands of the temps until next year.  Langdon is eligible for the postseason.  Come fall 2008, it will be like none of this ever happened.  We'd like to thank the NDHSAA for sweeping yet another controversial item under the rug. 

I know the co-op was never dissolved.  If they want to play for Cando, they sure can.  My question is how accepting will the Cando parents, coaches, and players be if they come back to play.  I heard these players had a meeting with the Cando players at the end of the year because the Cando players wanted to know why they wanted to leave.  I don't know if they will be treated any differently than they would have if this hadn't happened.  It would be funny if they sat on the bench but they have to much talent for Cando to pass up. 
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Postby Run With It » Thu Aug 02, 2007 5:15 pm

NDSportsFan wrote:My personnal opinion is that the NDHSAA did the right thing.  I'd rather spend my time protesting real problems like the rural meth epidemic, or escalating health care costs for the elderly, or even Michael Vicks dogfighting allegations. 

There comes a time to ignore those who won't let it rest.

well u do have a point with other problems...
but we have no control over m. vick dogfighting issues...
or nothing we really say is gunna help with the health care costs for the elderly...
i just think, as another high school athlete, that team got let off WAY to easy...yes a team is a team, including the coach...because everyone was bragging about her coming and that team knew something had to be going on..it dont take a brain surgeon to get that....but its done and i guess no one else can change it
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Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:12 pm

Run With It wrote:
NDSportsFan wrote:My personnal opinion is that the NDHSAA did the right thing.  I'd rather spend my time protesting real problems like the rural meth epidemic, or escalating health care costs for the elderly, or even Michael Vicks dogfighting allegations. 

There comes a time to ignore those who won't let it rest.

well u do have a point with other problems...
but we have no control over m. vick dogfighting issues...
or nothing we really say is gunna help with the health care costs for the elderly...
i just think, as another high school athlete, that team got let off WAY to easy...yes a team is a team, including the coach...because everyone was bragging about her coming and that team knew something had to be going on..it dont take a brain surgeon to get that....but its done and i guess no one else can change it

gotta agree with you...the langdon parents i know said the team was walking about since volleyball ended last year......
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Postby vballer5 » Wed Aug 08, 2007 7:23 pm

i think the NDHSAA made the right decision...! Nobody really knows what happened and this shouldnt even be a hot topic...thats enough talking bout this! LANGDON IS BACK IN BUSINESS!!!;)
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Postby fbinnd » Thu Aug 09, 2007 6:15 am

Yeah, we're all happy that your team was able to try to cheat, get caught, and still get away with it.  Good for you.  We're all glad that the rules don't apply to Langdon.  I really hope you win the state title this year, so we can all put it in the books with an asterisk *.

That asterisk will stand for, "Won while on probation from the NDHSAA for attempting to recruit players".

You will be the Barry Bonds of the North Dakota High School volleyball world.  Anything you do this year will be scrutinized.  Anything you win will be won under suspicion.  And if you win the title, either region or state, it will always be under circumstances where people know you shouldn't have been there.

I would refrain from stating anything about Langdon being "back in business".  Your school, your coaches, and your team have forever changed the face of high school sports, and in a negative way.  Your wins will be very hollow, and the entire state will be rooting against you.
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Postby NDSportsFan » Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:20 am

vballer5 wrote:i think the NDHSAA made the right decision...! Nobody really knows what happened and this shouldnt even be a hot topic...thats enough talking bout this! LANGDON IS BACK IN BUSINESS!!!;)


Wow, this topic was all but dead until you revived it.
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Postby point/center » Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:42 am

fbinnd wrote:Yeah, we're all happy that your team was able to try to cheat, get caught, and still get away with it.  Good for you.  We're all glad that the rules don't apply to Langdon.  I really hope you win the state title this year, so we can all put it in the books with an asterisk *.

That asterisk will stand for, "Won while on probation from the NDHSAA for attempting to recruit players".

You will be the Barry Bonds of the North Dakota High School volleyball world.  Anything you do this year will be scrutinized.  Anything you win will be won under suspicion.  And if you win the title, either region or state, it will always be under circumstances where people know you shouldn't have been there.

I would refrain from stating anything about Langdon being "back in business".  Your school, your coaches, and your team have forever changed the face of high school sports, and in a negative way.  Your wins will be very hollow, and the entire state will be rooting against you.

didnt their coach and assistant coach get removed from their role for 1 year as part of the appeal agreement? how is that getting off? that should have been punishment all along
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Postby fbinnd » Thu Aug 09, 2007 9:47 am

The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.
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Postby Stromer » Thu Aug 09, 2007 10:26 am

fbinnd wrote:The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.

Mind you, the only person talking about Langdon being back into business is a person who first stated she played against Langdon, and then changed her story to include her as a player.  Who really knows where she is from but she is hardly believable.
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Postby point/center » Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:01 am

fbinnd wrote:The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.
what did the Langdon players do?

so probation and having sit out a year is NOT punishment? Apply for a job with NDHSAA when it opens up, run for the Executive Board, get appointed....cause I don't think complaining on a message board will change the outcome.
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Postby MLCFB » Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:35 am

point/center wrote:
fbinnd wrote:The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.
what did the Langdon players do?

so probation and having sit out a year is NOT punishment? Apply for a job with NDHSAA when it opens up, run for the Executive Board, get appointed....cause I don't think complaining on a message board will change the outcome.


I have quickly read this whole thread and am not sure if you, p/c, wrote an opinion or a solution on the punishment.  So what, in your opinion, should have been the punishment?

IMOP, the program should have been punished like the NDHSAA had in the begining.  Just like college programs get punished for illegal recruiting or boosters giving money. 
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Postby point/center » Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:37 am

MLCFB wrote:
point/center wrote:
fbinnd wrote:The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.
what did the Langdon players do?

so probation and having sit out a year is NOT punishment? Apply for a job with NDHSAA when it opens up, run for the Executive Board, get appointed....cause I don't think complaining on a message board will change the outcome.


I have quickly read this whole thread and am not sure if you, p/c, wrote an opinion or a solution on the punishment.  So what, in your opinion, should have been the punishment?

IMOP, the program should have been punished like the NDHSAA had in the begining.  Just like college programs get punished for illegal recruiting or boosters giving money. 
i'll take what NDHSAA did in the end...works for me. coaches get punished. program is on probation...nobody wins
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Postby BBall dominator » Thu Aug 09, 2007 1:20 pm

point/center wrote:
MLCFB wrote:
point/center wrote:
fbinnd wrote:The team is still on probation.  This idea that Langdon is "back in business" is rediculous.  They are being graciously allowed to participate under scrutiny of the member schools of the NDHSAA.

And the coaches having their jobs kept by some patsies for a year is no punishment at all.  They will be back next year, and, like I've said before, in the fall of 2008, it will be like the whole event never happened.  So, no, the coaches being removed for a year is not punishment.

I love how these Langdon players think they have been vindicated by the new ruling.  They now think they can come in here and talk smack because the NDHSAA took pity on some waling and gnashing of teeth from Langdon?  They should be about as humble as anyone has ever been.  They should just sit back, play the game, and not draw any attention to themselves.  Instead, they're in here touting how they got out of recruiting charges scott free.

Again, I really, really hope they win it all, so we can put the scarlet letter on the program for all eternity.
what did the Langdon players do?

so probation and having sit out a year is NOT punishment? Apply for a job with NDHSAA when it opens up, run for the Executive Board, get appointed....cause I don't think complaining on a message board will change the outcome.


I have quickly read this whole thread and am not sure if you, p/c, wrote an opinion or a solution on the punishment.  So what, in your opinion, should have been the punishment?

IMOP, the program should have been punished like the NDHSAA had in the begining.  Just like college programs get punished for illegal recruiting or boosters giving money. 
i'll take what NDHSAA did in the end...works for me. coaches get punished. program is on probation...nobody wins
I also agree  the adults who commited the infraction are punished I bet they enjoy coaching and now they've been repremanded I mean recruiting is wrong any way you slice it but they didn't give players money or gifts so a year gone and probation for a 1st time offender is definetly fair and to say the ruined ND HS sports is ridiculious FBINND I think if anything it'll add more excitement just like how people root against trinity now the fans will root against langdon this upcoming year should be interesting
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