If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

No smack talk is allowed here.

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby scruffy » Tue Feb 19, 2008 1:37 pm

Indians alumni...THERE YOU GO AGAIN! Color or race SHOULDN'T matter! Scholarships should be awarded based on merit and nothing else. It should have nothing to do with quota's or anything. What's wrong with old fashioned MERIT! If you earn it you deserve it........
No whiners allowed! The journey is the reward!
scruffy
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 779
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:10 pm
Location: dickinson, , USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby NDSportsFan » Tue Feb 19, 2008 5:10 pm

I dont' think it matters what type of a deal that UND offers the tribes, Standing Rock will not accept it. Spirit Lake seems more open, and a lot of the residents there actually like the attention. But that's a long way from unanimous support. Personally I wish that we could put the issue to bed. No amount of message board discussion is going to convince those who feel offended that it's not racist. And those with close ties to the school that have done their best to portray the imagery of the Fighting Sioux with respect, will never understand how it's offensive.
User avatar
NDSportsFan
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 2116
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 7:35 am
Location: Fargo

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby Mr. Knowitall » Tue Feb 19, 2008 6:52 pm

What may not be offensive to you, may in fact be offensive to others. That's what's going on right now. How can the university possibly believe they are honoring the Dakota/Lakota people by using a nickname that was given to the Dakota people by their enemy, which were the Chippewa. In which the nickname "Sioux" means I believe, snake. And a snake in our culture symbolizes deceitfullness and deviancy. Our people don't even recognize ourselves as Sioux people. The only people that do are uneducated. And the Dakota/Lakota people that support the nickname are usually not very educated. With that said why should the Dakota/Lakota people allow these people to belittle us? We're deprived of a whole lot of things today. One thing we don't want to be deprived of anymore is our pride.
Experience tells you what to do; confidence allows you to do it.
User avatar
Mr. Knowitall
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:55 pm
Location: Fort Totten, North Dakota

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby OldSchool » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:47 pm

So when tribal leaders years ago gave the approval they didn't know this fact? They were not educated on the meaning, and the fact that the name Sioux was in fact given to you by your enemies and meant something totally different then we portray today, as a fierce warrior? Fill me in some more Mr. Knowitall.
OldSchool
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 130
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:05 am

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby Mr. Knowitall » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:43 am

OldSchool wrote:So when tribal leaders years ago gave the approval they didn't know this fact? They were not educated on the meaning, and the fact that the name Sioux was in fact given to you by your enemies and meant something totally different then we portray today, as a fierce warrior? Fill me in some more Mr. Knowitall.


As a fierce warrior? Where did I mention I was a fierce warrior? The state recognized us as Sioux people back then. As of right now we're not recognized as the Spirit Lake Sioux Tribe anymore, because of the reasons I stated before. That's why this name creates an unnecessary avenue for racism. In a sense, you're making fun of our culture by saying I consider myself a fierce warrior for addressing the nickname issue. And another thing good bye Ralph Engelstad Arena, and also the Betty :wink: .
Experience tells you what to do; confidence allows you to do it.
User avatar
Mr. Knowitall
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:55 pm
Location: Fort Totten, North Dakota

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby scruffy » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:52 am

There are also high schools in the area who use the name "Sioux" or "Warriors", and some of those have been on Indian reservations. I haven't heard complaining about that....
No whiners allowed! The journey is the reward!
scruffy
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 779
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:10 pm
Location: dickinson, , USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby sportsking09 » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:34 pm

actually mr. knowitall, the englestad and the betty only have to get the removable logo removed and the other covered if possible, os hello and it will be hello forever to the ralph englestad arena and the betty, but they arent gonna have to cover or take any logos down because the name is going to rename as it is, the best name in the world, FIGHTING SIOUX,FIGHTING SIOUX, FIGHTING SIOUX, go SIOUX, i mean go FIGHTING sioux
University of North Dakota Fighting Sioux, and thats the way its gonna stay
GO SIOUX!!!!
sportsking09
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 12:38 pm
Location: North Dakota

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby Mr. Knowitall » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:05 pm

sportsking09 wrote:actually mr. knowitall, the englestad and the betty only have to get the removable logo removed and the other covered if possible, os hello and it will be hello forever to the ralph englestad arena and the betty, but they arent gonna have to cover or take any logos down because the name is going to rename as it is, the best name in the world, FIGHTING SIOUX,FIGHTING SIOUX, FIGHTING SIOUX, go SIOUX, i mean go FIGHTING sioux


Okay get real, the name is going to change. Unless UND gives an arm and leg. In which I don't think will happen. If I'm not mistaken Ralph Englestad had in his will that the arena is to be destroyed if the name was to ever change.
Experience tells you what to do; confidence allows you to do it.
User avatar
Mr. Knowitall
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:55 pm
Location: Fort Totten, North Dakota

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby NDSportsFan » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:09 pm

I'm pretty sure that its been reported that the Englestad family has stated that nothing like that would be done if the name is changed. I'm sure I read that in the Herald not too long ago.
User avatar
NDSportsFan
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 2116
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 7:35 am
Location: Fargo

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby OldSchool » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:35 pm

Mr. Knowitall wrote:
sportsking09 wrote:actually mr. knowitall, the englestad and the betty only have to get the removable logo removed and the other covered if possible, os hello and it will be hello forever to the ralph englestad arena and the betty, but they arent gonna have to cover or take any logos down because the name is going to rename as it is, the best name in the world, FIGHTING SIOUX,FIGHTING SIOUX, FIGHTING SIOUX, go SIOUX, i mean go FIGHTING sioux


Okay get real, the name is going to change. Unless UND gives an arm and leg. In which I don't think will happen.


Of course its about money again!!! You and Indians Alumni are unbelievable. I hope it does change then you will see real racism.

Oh and the Ralph and Beatty will be fine. The Beatty was built after Mr. Englestad passed away anyway, but the Ralph will always be there to remind you of the racism that it showed. You can bring your kids by and tell them how bad things were back in the 2000's.
And I also want to hear your ideas on the warriors, and sioux as used by high school reservations.
OldSchool
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 130
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:05 am

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby Indians Alumni » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:45 pm

If I can get some of the Spirit Lake youth Educated on UND's dime, then I am all for it! I am not asking anything from you, why YOU so offended? UND has used the name without permission for so long! Time for a change!
It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up. ~Muhammed Ali
User avatar
Indians Alumni
NDPreps Hall of Fame
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 11:44 am
Location: Devils Lake. ND

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby Indians Alumni » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:46 pm

Also, if that is such a perfect situation of MERIT, then why was a system like United Nigro College Fund or Diversity Waivers set up? I mean the MERIT thing didn't work!
It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up. ~Muhammed Ali
User avatar
Indians Alumni
NDPreps Hall of Fame
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 11:44 am
Location: Devils Lake. ND

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby OldSchool » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:33 pm

Indians Alumni wrote:If I can get some of the Spirit Lake youth Educated on UND's dime, then I am all for it! I am not asking anything from you, why YOU so offended? UND has used the name without permission for so long! Time for a change!


They had permission many years ago, but now it seems that you think that your opinion is more powerful than that of your ancestors that gave that permission.

You are asking something of me also, but I would expect you to think outside the box. Those would be my tax dollars going to fund the youth of spirit lake which i have no problem with as long as they are earning these educations just like everyone else is. United Negro college fund? What? That is a stretch are African Americans living on reservations and provided millions of dollars in housing, schools, and health care? Far from it.
OldSchool
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 130
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:05 am

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby scruffy » Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:17 am

To me, diversity waivers is racist and should not be allowed. I don't care about quota's, sex or color of skin. If an INDIVIDUAL is deserving he or she should be rewarded. I like to look at all people as being equal and nobody should be "handed" anything based on quota's etc....
No whiners allowed! The journey is the reward!
scruffy
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 779
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:10 pm
Location: dickinson, , USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby SDHoops » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:36 pm

scruffy wrote:To me, diversity waivers is racist and should not be allowed. I don't care about quota's, sex or color of skin. If an INDIVIDUAL is deserving he or she should be rewarded. I like to look at all people as being equal and nobody should be "handed" anything based on quota's etc....

You don't understand the hardships that many Native Americans as well as other minorities go through. When the dominant "Anglo" group has minorities within itself (chubby, nerdy, etc.), they set aside all of their differences just to pick on the ethnic minorities. We are proud of our heritage and check the optional Native American box when applying for jobs in places like Bismarck and Fargo, yet it fires back in our faces even when we are well qualified for the job. Knowing how hard it has been for so many people and lacking cultural diversity, they have come up with cultural waivers to increase a diverse student body. I know that many colleges in the region have been under scrutiny by their higher education boards for being close in proximity to many reservations, yet have very few students from there. Also, with reservation towns being so small, that is a good way to advertise their university by having one of their graduates working back or near the rez. Students who get these waivers have to maintain certain criteria to obtain and maintain the waiver so don't be jealous. If UND wants to keep the name, they should offer full scholarships that cover all education related expenses for students from the Spirit Lake and Standing Rock Sioux Tribes.
User avatar
SDHoops
NDPreps Starter
 
Posts: 93
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: Down South, , USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby balla45 » Thu Feb 21, 2008 3:48 pm

scruffy wrote:I don't think there should be any scholarships set up for people of a certain race, ethnic background, or sex. Thats classic RACISM.... Everyone should be treated equally and racism should never be allowed.


Why is it racism when a minority gets a benefit, but not racism when a minority gets disrespected?
~I have no patience for anyone who doubts me, none at all. My entire goal is to make them feel ashamed for writing me off.

Jordan Maurer
North Dakota Phenom - President
jordan.maurer@northdakotaphenom.com

If you do not like how I operate, play for someone else. I do not need to beg.

~It does not take talent to hustle!
User avatar
balla45
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 4089
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 5:46 pm
Location: Bismarck, North Dakota USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby scruffy » Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:21 pm

To me, showing disrespect is racist although I admit I'm not convinced a knickname shows a lack of respect, especially since it's been around 100 years.. .Racism is a two way street! I don't like it at all. That's why it should have nothing to do with who gets scholarships or anything like that..
No whiners allowed! The journey is the reward!
scruffy
NDPreps All-State
 
Posts: 779
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:10 pm
Location: dickinson, , USA

Re: If you don't like the sioux....do you have a better suggesti

Postby NDSportsFan » Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:25 pm

This has gotten way off topic.
User avatar
NDSportsFan
NDPreps Legend
 
Posts: 2116
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 7:35 am
Location: Fargo

Previous

Return to North Dakota's Universities and Colleges

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest