Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

[nc]

If i had ot choose one person to be on my team i pick Kobe hands down. Kobe makes the players around him better. Odom, Gasol, tell me that Shaq would have been as dominant if Kobe wasnt there with him, you cant. Kobe did everythign he could last finals because his supporting cast didnt do anything, they got dominated down low. Lebron is finally getting some players around him but the east still isnt very strong, of course you have the celtics, now dominant than ever and the magic, but nelson is out now, who is the top competitors in the east? What happend to the "chosen one" when he made the finals? they got dominated liek they didnt even belon there. Im just sick of Lebron trying to hard to be like Kobe and Jordan. When Kobe scored 62 in the garden the hype was can lebron out do him, you know he tried his hardest to score more than kobe and it obviously didnt work. Now Lebron is talking about changing his number, kinda like Kobe did and how jordan did for a lil bit. I give the MVP to kobe right now as you can tell im not a big lebron fan.

[baseball]

If i had ot choose one person to be on my team i pick Kobe hands down. Kobe makes the players around him better. Odom, Gasol, tell me that Shaq would have been as dominant if Kobe wasnt there with him, you cant. Kobe did everythign he could last finals because his supporting cast didnt do anything, they got dominated down low. Lebron is finally getting some players around him but the east still isnt very strong, of course you have the celtics, now dominant than ever and the magic, but nelson is out now, who is the top competitors in the east? What happend to the "chosen one" when he made the finals? they got dominated liek they didnt even belon there. Im just sick of Lebron trying to hard to be like Kobe and Jordan. When Kobe scored 62 in the garden the hype was can lebron out do him, you know he tried his hardest to score more than kobe and it obviously didnt work. Now Lebron is talking about changing his number, kinda like Kobe did and how jordan did for a lil bit. I give the MVP to kobe right now as you can tell im not a big lebron fan.

yea i can tell your a not a lebron fan, but i can also tell you know nothing about basketball. Kobe makes the players around him better better then Lebron does? yeah...odom was a pile when with the clippers and heat. Gasol wasnt an all-star with the Grizz. did you know shaq used to play in Orlando even? then again he was only good becuase Penny was on his team? but your right, shaq was nothing without Kobe.

are you really trying to say Szerbiak, Verajo, Ilgauskus, Gibson, and Williams are better then Gasol, Odom, Farmar, Fisher, and Vujacic??

Maybe Lebron did try to out-do Kobe, and if you look at more then points....um...he did. 52-11-9!!! do you understand what that means? that trumps 62 and 3 anyday. if he tried his hardest to score more he wouldnt have had 11 assists...even if you do just look at points to see whos better. last time i checked 28.5 was more then 27.7 = Lebron > Kobe because he scores more. then again, Kobe is a better rebounder...o wait, Lebron gets more of them too. has to be a better passer....nevermind, have to pass for that one. the only thing Kobe does better is shoot from the outside...then again Lebron is catching him there. Kobe for his career is 34.1% from three...Lebron is 32.1%

Maybe its just me but i would even give MVP this year to Dwayne Wade before Kobe

1. Lebron
2. Wade
3. Kobe

[nc]

i really dont think you understood me, the other lakers are better than the other cavs but kobe has helped improve there games the past couple years, shaq is a monster and alwasy will be but he was even more dominant with kobe on his team. You can throw all the stats out that you want about kobe and lebron but the most important stat would be the record. I just get sick on how kobe is always compared to lebron and lebron is always compared to kobe. Let each other pkay their own game and it would be nice to see this two meet uo in the finals which is a great possibility

[baseball]

i really dont think you understood me, the other lakers are better than the other cavs but kobe has helped improve there games the past couple years, shaq is a monster and alwasy will be but he was even more dominant with kobe on his team. You can throw all the stats out that you want about kobe and lebron but the most important stat would be the record. I just get sick on how kobe is always compared to lebron and lebron is always compared to kobe. Let each other pkay their own game and it would be nice to see this two meet uo in the finals which is a great possibility

see the conection between the 2?? LeBron carried his team to the finals on his back alone when he was 22...22!!! Kobe can't do that even now. won titles because he had Shaq, and got to the finals last year because they brought in Gasol. I'm not denying Kobe has made them better, but Lebron is better at making his teammates better.

[north_border_eagles2106]

i really dont think you understood me, the other lakers are better than the other cavs but kobe has helped improve there games the past couple years, shaq is a monster and alwasy will be but he was even more dominant with kobe on his team. You can throw all the stats out that you want about kobe and lebron but the most important stat would be the record. I just get sick on how kobe is always compared to lebron and lebron is always compared to kobe. Let each other pkay their own game and it would be nice to see this two meet uo in the finals which is a great possibility

Ok nc, I've been reading these last few posts between you and baseball and all I can tell is that you are a biased Laker fan. How do you figure Shaq wouldnt've been as dominant without Kobe on that team? His numbers would've been even more ridiculous had Kobe not been there to shoot 25 times a game. He wouldnt've won the championships obviously but then again neither would Kobe without Shaq.

How has Kobe done anything to improve their games over the past few years? Before they got Gasol they were a 6-7 seed in the playoffs every year and were beat in the first round. He really improved them alot before they got Gasol. He hasn't done anything to improve Gasol or Bynum. He didn't start to embrace Bynum untill he started to get better through the help of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. Before that Kobe was trashing Laker management and didn't agree with selecting Bynum. There isn't a right or wrong answer when it comes to this but I will never agree that you can pick one or the other "hands down" as you did for Kobe.

I'm sick of people that are LeBron haters and won't give him any credit because he hasn't won a championship. He's been in the league five years and hasn't been on near as elite of a team as Kobe was early in his career. Before Kobe had even averaged 20+ points per game LeBron was averaging 31.7 points per game. LeBrons numbers are better than Kobes if you look at points, rebounds, and assists in every season. Do you not remember when he played in the finals in the fourth quarter he had guys like Donyell Marshall to pass the ball to? I just don't understand how people rip on Lebron. Put him on that Lakers team and they would challenge the bulls 72 wins record.

I think that LeBron is harder to stop completely because if you hold down his scoring he's going to burn you with his innate passing ability. He sees the same double teams Kobe does but he is able to find his teammates better and is more willing that Kobe.

[BballFan1307]

They are two different players. Lebron is more athletic and gets to the rim, Kobe can hit any kind of jump shot. However, i just love how you guys make it seem like Kobe is on a dream team. hahaha pau gasol?? averages 18 points this year... thats only 5 more points pg than the big z, and he's terrible. then you got derek fisher... he was alright... 7 years ago. Luke walton is dominant. Bynum is good. but never plays. I mean you do have a point he still has Chris Mihm coming off the bench. Lamar Odom is good, but what, does he have a good game every ten games? I don't think Kobe is put in such a perfect situation. They aren't good. He makes them good.

[baseball]

No one is saying they would win the title without Kobe. the fact is who would you rather have...LeBron's supporting cast or Kobe's?? Not a hard question to answer. Having a Center who averages 18 and 9 is terrible...Kobe made Gasol an all-star in Memphis. Would big Z have been an all-star without LeBron? not a chance. Odom isnt so much a great player, instead a player every team wants. hes a big guy who can handle the ball and cause match up problems. Fisher is shooting the ball better now then he has ever in his career. sure hes old but hes putting up the same numbers he did 7 years ago....00-01 he averaged 11.4 and 4.3 APG. 01-02 he averaged 11.2 and 2.6. 02-03 10.5 and 3.6. 03-04 7.1 and 3.2. this year...10.8 and 3.7. not a big drop off is you ask me.

[gunslinger13]

I dont see how theres even a discussion here Lebron is better than kobe and has way more potential to hes 24 years old and domanites every aspect of the game

[The Schwab]

They are two different players. Lebron is more athletic and gets to the rim, Kobe can hit any kind of jump shot. However, i just love how you guys make it seem like Kobe is on a dream team. hahaha pau gasol?? averages 18 points this year... thats only 5 more points pg than the big z, and he's terrible. then you got derek fisher... he was alright... 7 years ago. Luke walton is dominant. Bynum is good. but never plays. I mean you do have a point he still has Chris Mihm coming off the bench. Lamar Odom is good, but what, does he have a good game every ten games? I don't think Kobe is put in such a perfect situation. They aren't good. He makes them good.

Every time Luke Walton scores...god kills a kitten.

[BballFan1307]

I dont see how theres even a discussion here Lebron is better than kobe and has way more potential to hes 24 years old and domanites every aspect of the game

i dont think anyone's ever argued that one buddy. i mean isnt it quite obvious that a 24 year old has more potential than a 30 plus year old???

[north_border_eagles2106]

They are two different players. Lebron is more athletic and gets to the rim, Kobe can hit any kind of jump shot. However, i just love how you guys make it seem like Kobe is on a dream team. hahaha pau gasol?? averages 18 points this year... thats only 5 more points pg than the big z, and he's terrible. then you got derek fisher... he was alright... 7 years ago. Luke walton is dominant. Bynum is good. but never plays. I mean you do have a point he still has Chris Mihm coming off the bench. Lamar Odom is good, but what, does he have a good game every ten games? I don't think Kobe is put in such a perfect situation. They aren't good. He makes them good.

Ryan, you can't sit there and tell me Kobe's team isn't better than LeBrons. Especially the teams that they took to the finals in the past two years. On the 2007 Cavaliers they had Daniel Gibson, Drew Gooden, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Lebron, and Sasha Pavlovic starting. Damon Jones, Donyell Marshall, Eric snow, Anderson Varejao coming off the bench. In case you were wondering It does says Donyell Marshall, Eric Snow, and Damon Jones on that list.

I am not saying the Lakers have a dream team by any means but I think the line up of Derek Fisher, Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom, and Andrew Bynum is better than Maurice WIlliams, Wally Szczerbiak, Ben Wallace, and Zydrunas Ilgauskas. Once Bynum gets back the Lakers line up is leaps and bounds better than the Cavaliers line up. Even with Luke Walton as a starter I'd say the lakers have a slight edge. The one thing that sets the lakers apart is their second unit is probably the best in the NBA.

Kobe doesn't make his players better any more than LeBron. If anything LeBron has the edge in that category because his ability to find an open teammate. When you watch LeBron get assists you can tell most of the time he is driving the lane with the intention of finding his teammates early in the game to get their confidence up. He takes it to the rim himself if they are off to a slow start or behind, like any leader would do. When Kobe didn't have the supporting cast around him he just shot, shot, shot, shot, and shot some more. He wasn't making anyone better in 05-06 when he averaged 35 a game and lead them to the 6th seed and a first round exit to the Suns.

[BballFan1307]

hahaha no, obviously kobe's team is better. i was just saying i think its retarded how people on here are giving Kobe no credit what so ever for his team being good. Some people have said his team would be a playoff team even if he wasn't on it. which is absolutely false. The lakers lineup is slightly better than the cavs. however. when we say who makes who better. obviously some of these role players are gonna have good numbers. opposing teams plan to stop kobe and lebron. Pau gets 18 points a game because he gets open looks because he's not concentrated on. Mo Williams gets his open looks from Lebrons ability to drive and team's defenses have to try stop him. I honestly don't know who is better. I think Lebron was given a lot more athletic ability than Kobe, but is he a better bball player. i ddont know.

[north_border_eagles2106]

hahaha no, obviously kobe's team is better. i was just saying i think its retarded how people on here are giving Kobe no credit what so ever for his team being good. Some people have said his team would be a playoff team even if he wasn't on it. which is absolutely false. The lakers lineup is slightly better than the cavs. however. when we say who makes who better. obviously some of these role players are gonna have good numbers. opposing teams plan to stop kobe and lebron. Pau gets 18 points a game because he gets open looks because he's not concentrated on. Mo Williams gets his open looks from Lebrons ability to drive and team's defenses have to try stop him. I honestly don't know who is better. I think Lebron was given a lot more athletic ability than Kobe, but is he a better bball player. i ddont know.

Well actually I was one of those people saying that about the Lakers without Kobe. I don't think they are for sure a playoff team but they would be in the thick of the battle for 7th/8th place in the west. The Memphis Grizzlies were a 50-win team when they had Pau Gasol and no one else that impressive around him. I think if you have Fisher, Odom, Walton, Gasol, Bynum starting thats a pretty good team and could make a playoff push. But I agree that there is no way of telling who is better. They both bring unique things to the game and affect it in different way. There is no right or wrong answer here but I think LeBron is going to go down as a better player than Kobe at the end of his career.

[baller01]

Just a quick thing about comparing Kobe's post: Gasol. And LeBron's post: Big Z.

Have you ever noticed how Gasol and Big Z get there points. Gasol gets his points by himself. Very little help of Kobe. Most the time Gasol gets the ball in the post, and waits and waits, and then makes a move and scores. Kobe doesn't have much to do with Gasol scoring. For example... The night Kobe had 61 at MSG, Gasol had 31. Gasol had 31 while Kobe had 3 total assists. That tells you that Gasol does basically all of his scoring without Kobe.

However, have you noticed how Big Z scores? WIDE OPEN 12-18 footers. Why does Big Z get these WIDE OPEN 12-18 footers, because of LeBron.

I take Gasol 9 times outa 10 over Big Z and LeBron over Kobe 10 times outa 10.

[BballFan1307]

Kobe has nothing to do with Pau getting one on one matchups with no help side defense? I beleive he does. He attracts at least two guys to him, giving Pau ALOT of space to work without having to wrry about help.

[bballfan7]

They are two different players. Lebron is more athletic and gets to the rim, Kobe can hit any kind of jump shot. However, i just love how you guys make it seem like Kobe is on a dream team. hahaha pau gasol?? averages 18 points this year... thats only 5 more points pg than the big z, and he's terrible. then you got derek fisher... he was alright... 7 years ago. Luke walton is dominant. Bynum is good. but never plays. I mean you do have a point he still has Chris Mihm coming off the bench. Lamar Odom is good, but what, does he have a good game every ten games? I don't think Kobe is put in such a perfect situation. They aren't good. He makes them good.

Not no more, traded to the grizzlies for a second round pick.

[baseball]

Kobe has nothing to do with Pau getting one on one matchups with no help side defense? I beleive he does. He attracts at least two guys to him, giving Pau ALOT of space to work without having to wrry about help.

it was said best a few posts ago by the person who pointed how the Grizzlees were a 50 win team with Gasol. The Cavs were a "high-teen" win team with big Z before LeBron came to town.

[BballFan1307]

Gasol had a better team? The cavs were a high teen win team , only one season. 3 years before that 28 and above wins. The Grizzlies had 3 good seasons with Gasol. When he actually had a decent team with Jason Williams, Stromile Swift, Bonzi Wells, Lorenzen Wright, Shane Battier, Mike Miller and James Posey. That is a pretty decent team. So i can see how they win 50 games. and its not just because of Gasol. I mean watching the lakers its pretty easy to see Kobe is the reason Gasol scores...take last night for example. He gets double teamed passes over to Powell and because of the double team on Kobe the defense is all messed up and powell is able to hit Gasol for a lay up. There, Kobe is not credited with the assist, but is the reason Gasol is open. Also, when you said that Lebron would pass to a guy that is on fire instead of shoot himself and Kobe wouldnt. Well, last night, another example. Two straight possessions down by 5 with about 2 and a half minutes remaining. Kobe drives and dishes to Trevor Ariza for two straight 3's. Kobe and Lebron do all the same things. They both make their teams better. They are each better at different aspects of the game so its hard to say whos better.

[The Schwab]

Gasol had a better team? The cavs were a high teen win team , only one season. 3 years before that 28 and above wins. The Grizzlies had 3 good seasons with Gasol. When he actually had a decent team with Jason Williams, Stromile Swift, Bonzi Wells, Lorenzen Wright, Shane Battier, Mike Miller and James Posey. That is a pretty decent team. So i can see how they win 50 games. and its not just because of Gasol. I mean watching the lakers its pretty easy to see Kobe is the reason Gasol scores...take last night for example. He gets double teamed passes over to Powell and because of the double team on Kobe the defense is all messed up and powell is able to hit Gasol for a lay up. There, Kobe is not credited with the assist, but is the reason Gasol is open. Also, when you said that Lebron would pass to a guy that is on fire instead of shoot himself and Kobe wouldnt. Well, last night, another example. Two straight possessions down by 5 with about 2 and a half minutes remaining. Kobe drives and dishes to Trevor Ariza for two straight 3's. Kobe and Lebron do all the same things. They both make their teams better. They are each better at different aspects of the game so its hard to say whos better.

28 wins is not good...

[BballFan1307]

better than 17?

[BballFan1307]

Okay then, heres my question then. You guys say Lebron is better because he is playing with a worse team and making them better. You've also said that Kobe can't win a championship by himself and that his were because of Shaq. So lets say the Cavs pull off a trade, which they have been said to be targeting Jameson and butler of Washington. And then Lebron wins the championship. Does he get more credit for it than you guys give Kobe? Or will you say they won it solely because of Lebron?

[The Schwab]

Okay then, heres my question then. You guys say Lebron is better because he is playing with a worse team and making them better. You've also said that Kobe can't win a championship by himself and that his were because of Shaq. So lets say the Cavs pull off a trade, which they have been said to be targeting Jameson and butler of Washington. And then Lebron wins the championship. Does he get more credit for it than you guys give Kobe? Or will you say they won it solely because of Lebron?

Shaq in L.A. was the most dominating center of the modern era, and Jamison and Butler are no where near the same level as L.A. Shaq, but if it would happen and they would win the championship, Lebron would have had an upgraded lineup to help him win the championship. I would however give Lebron more credit than Kobe deserves for his role in the championship

[baseball]

98-99 22-28
99-00 32-50
00-01 30-52
01-02 29-53
02-03 17-65

team is obviously declining, so lets draft LeBron.

03-04 35-47
04-05 42-40
05-06 50-32
06-07 50-32 NBA Finals
07-08 45-37 Eastern Conference Finals
08-09 41-11

[north_border_eagles2106]

better than 17?

28 wins is better than 17 but it still isn't good. It's just less crappy. Gasol's team in Memphis good, not great. They were never better than a 4 seed and couldn't get out of the first round. The reason for that is because Gasol didn't have anyone that could score from the perimeter unless open for a three. Kobe couldn't get out of the first round because he didn't have someone to score in the paint unless wide open for a dunk.

It's not Kobe's fault that he was traded from Charlotte to the Lakers and played with Shaq, but at the same time it's not LeBron's fault that he was drafted by Cleveland and after they got him they stopped getting players around him that were any good. We've seen what LeBron can do with a team with nothing around him and we've seen what Kobe has done. I think it was about a wash because the east isn't as good and once they played San Antonio they got killed. That being said, I think Lebron through his first five seasons winning no championships and dominating the league is better than Kobe being a 20ppg scorer on a team with 90s West Shaq and winning a few championships. You have to remember Kobe has been around the nba a lot longer and is more experienced. LeBron at 24 vs. Kobe at 24 is no contest. It's LeBron.

[baseball]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqcgy6xL ... re=related

always looks for the open teammate....